Huns and Central Asians in kung fu movies

[Guest Frank Lakatos]

I'm a Central Asian history buff, and out of all of the kung fu movies I've ever seen so far, besides the Manchus, very few Central Asian ethnicities that were part of China's history were used in the stories, but I have NEVER seen kung fu/wu zia with Huns(Xiong Nu in Mandarin), and they played as much of a role in Chines ehistory as the mongols. So far, these following movies have these Central Asian tribes. Anybody know of any Kung Fu/Wu Xia with Huns and Central Asians?

Kung Fu Hero(1987): Turkish kung fu fighters with turbans and moon shapped swords!

Silent Swordsman(1966): Northen Mongol mixed Huaxia tribes and Mongols, with great casting finding actors with the rough Mongol type faces. Beautiful accurate costuming, something that was lost in the later low budget kung fu movies. I love the use of the central Asian rolled up spike tipped shoes.

Shaolin Against Lama(1987): 2 Persian assassins. Awesome.

Slice of Death(1979): Chiang Tao decently playing a Burmese Lama.

Magnificent Wonderman from Shaolin: The nearly blue eyed Hyeon Kil Su makes an outstanding Mongol.

Zatoichi vs the White Wolf: The story isn't about mongols, but the villains are of north west Chinese stock Uyghur/Turkic/Mongol stock.

This is off topic, but I'll bring this up since I'm on the subject of Central Asians. A few years ago, a Chinese friend of mine payed for a DNA test and wanted me to join along because of my interest in Asian culture. He said I had asiatic slanted eyes, facial features, and "the bloody mongol" smile he called it. I must admit I am Hungarian and my grandfather looked different from any Hungarian I've ever seen, so I put together the money to pay for the DNA test. My results came back, but I could not understand them. They said that my Y-DNA is of Haplotype C3, but I do not know where this descends from excatly, possibly western Siberia? For the last few years, I did not enquire further into my DNA, until recently, when I asked a well informed person on a genealogy forum about the Y-Haplotype C3 gene, and that person said that it's not a typical Hungarian Haplotype, as most Hungarians have Haplotype J, which is said to come from Persia, where the Magyars and Avars, ancestors of the modern Hungarian people, descended from. Does anyone happen to know what Haplotype C3 stands for? I'd love to learn about this particular Haplotype one day.

There are quite a few European people that have Asiatic features. For instance Charles Bronson(Buchinski) and Robert "Maniac Cop" Z'dar(Z'darsky). They look like descndants of Mongol/Turkic Tatars, which can be found in Russia, Lithuania, Poland, Finland, China, and Japan(immigrants). Maybe Haplotype C3 belongs to the Tatar subcategory? But, there are no records of Tatars permanently settling in Hungary, at least, not in the part of Hungary where my ancestors come from.

Then you have William Shatner, Jackie Mason, Jerry Stiller, and Mel Brooks who look like they descended from the Khazars, who were then called the Yiddish people in the middle ages, who were later called Ashkenazic Jews, who are really Mongol/Turkic/Slavic converts to the Talmud who make you 90% of European Jews. Noah, a gentile, had a grandson, Japeth, who had 6 sons, and 3 of them made up the Turkic peoples: Magog, Gog, and Gomer. Gomer then had 3 sons: Ashkenaz, Riphath and Togarmah. For me, this is an interesting subject, but trust me, the deeper I go into it, the more redundant it becomes to others, so apologies if I bore anybody.

Peace

Frank

[Guest killer meteor]

I could be wrong but I think The Heroic Ones centres around a Hun family

[Guest Frank Lakatos]

Hey, that's awesome! Thanks for telling me about that movie, as I will see that asap!

Frank

[Guest gfanikf]

The Brave Archer Films and Marco Polo feature Hun costumes and such. I'm a histroy buff myself and love finding out little things in martial arts films that reference actual history.

[Guest killer meteor]

Hey, that's awesome! Thanks for telling me about that movie, as I will see that asap!

I could be wrong but the film is fun anyway!

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huns

[Guest Frank Lakatos]

I'm the same, it looks like the early Shaw Wu Xia and early Taiwanese movies have these Central Asian characters and themes. It just makes things more interesting. Look at what I found:

www.mongolmovie.com/

imdb.com/title/tt0416044/

This is coming out in theaters soon

This is movie Steven Seagal allegedly turned down, he was going to play Ghengis, and Donnie Yen was to be involved, but I could be mistakened they might be doing another version. I mean this movie looks awesome, a cross cultural production using actors from every nation to play the Mongols, starring Japan's Tadanou Asabo as Ghengis, HK's Honglei Sun, and Mongol's Amadu Mamadakov among a bunch of Mongolian and mainland Chinese actors. Interested in seeing this. Nice accurate costumes and actors. It's been years since there was a Ghengis biopic, except for John Wayne's version and that 60's Palance Italian one. That last biography on Attila the Hun, that horrible USA Network TV movie was a pityful disgrace. It looked like a watered down celtic war movie than a bloody Hun spectacle. Badly casted. Gerard Butler as Attila? Give me a break. It shows you the jealousy the Hollywood industry has on European/central Asian leaders and founders of their respected countries.

I was looking through the credits of the movie and found mainland actor Ba Te playing Kasar, which could mean "Khazar." Interested to know if he'll play a "Khazar" and if the Turkic tribes are represented in this movie. Khazar means "nomadic" in Turkic among the word's different meanings.

Frank

the Yiddish language: Chutzpa: unbelievable gall; insolence; audacity

from an archaic Mongolian dialect: Kutpa: A rebellious, hostile person.

[Guest Knockabout]

Interesting topic.. A fact that I've thought about many times as well. You'd think that movies about the building of the great wall and the rampaging mongolians would be a choice subject for kung fu plots, but you never see them???

One movie with focus on mongolians that springs to mind, is the korean movie Musa.. Granted not an old school, but nice anyway..

[Guest wanchaitransient]

as most Hungarians have Haplotype J, which is said to come from Persia, where the Magyars and Avars, ancestors of the modern Hungarian people, descended from.

Not really. Modern Hungarians have at least 5 Haplogroups and 15 subgroups in their blood none of which is C-3. They are mixed with Slavs, Germans, Serbians, Croatians, and western Europeans. I'm no expert in Hungarian migrations, but southern Hungary has populations that are homogenous to an already mixed Hun, Magyar, Avar, Yasigian, Tartar, Khazar, andKypchak blood untouched by foriegn European blood. The north is almost completely Slovak with the exception of the Iranian Yasigian people. You'd have to ask a Hungarian anthropologist about this to really know but most Hungarians carry European blood and little of their Turanian ancestry.

Does anyone happen to know what Haplotype C3 stands for? I'd love to learn about this particular Haplotype one day.

Its definately Mongolian Frank and not Hungarian. You might be related to the firece warrior strategist and sex machine Ghengis Khan himself. Ghengis Khan Haplotype C-3 Ghengis's army raided Hungary quite a few times and they kidnapped Hungarian women for Big Smooth Daddy Ghengis so I'm not surprised if you're his descendant like mot of the people in Mongolia and the surrounding countries not mentioning Ghengis's army and the entire Mongolian population. I used to be into history but it's old news to me now. Hand me a Pilsner beer and we'll celebrate.

Yiddish is fascinating if you know the truth. It happened like this: Sorbs(NOT Serbs, but SOrbs, a tribe of slavs from western Russian territories) that converted to talmudic Judiasm with most of the Khazars(it started as a choice with the nobles converting, then the Khagan "king" Bulan went overboard with his new religion, which then lead to forced conversion, either the talmud or execution)migrated to Germany(a land of founded by a branch of the Khazars' ancestors, sons of Ashkenaz) and set the foundation to Yiddish identity and language. Anything with the word "Yid" is Sorb Khazar. Now, when the country Khazaria finally fell apart by the Russian and Mongolian conquests, the Khazars fled through out Europe, towards Germany, a land and people they have ancestral kinship to, in search of a new homeland. The Khazars traveled westward, some into Poland and Hungary, and some into Germany(to the land Ashkenaz, which was founded by a branch of the Khazar's ancestors, the sons of Ashkenaz) and then added their Turco Mongol language Khazar into the already Slavic German based Yiddish which was already set by the converted Slavic Sorbs. The Khazars then settled with their Slavic converts Sorbs and then called themselves Yid and their language Yiddish as the Sorbs did. A few centuries later, the Khazar Sorbs now known as Yids, migrated back to eastern Europe and spread their new surnames, language, and religion(since the introduction of talmudic Judaism in Khazaria, the talmud was altered[specifically Kol Nidre, corrupted to the "don't eat with gentiles, don't comb your hair like gentiles, no and no to gentiles" ect] in order to suit the Khazar, Sorb, Yid people's interest, defying the original law of the covenant. It's still a very big issue in the Jewish religion, but the Talmudic Khazar, Sorb, Yid, Slavic majority in the world has quelled the conservative outrage). Then, the Khazar, Yid, Sorbs started identifying themselves as "Jews" of Ashkenaz(Turkic;The sons of Japheth: Gomer, Magog, Madai, Javan, Tubal, Meshech, and Tiras. The sons of Gomer: Ashkenaz, Riphath, and Togarmah) confusing the Europeans who did not know the entire of the history Khazars, mistakening them for real Jews, the seed of Abraham. There was a law passed by Napoleone labeling the Yiddish Jews I believe, but the identity and word Jew is basically either Self styled or a misconception. By blood, bone, culture, and country, 90% of Ashkenazic Jews are not real Jews, not real sons of Abraham, Shem, ect tribe, but are the descendants of Japheth and Ham, meaning the Ashkenazic jews are of central Asian Turkic descent. A small number 10% of Khazar, Sorb, Yid, Ashkenazic Jews(that carry authentic Sephardic high priest Rabbinical names Levi and Cohanim, BUT it was popular for Khazars to change their names as they did in Germany, the Khazars also changed their names to Rabbinical high priest names Levy and Cohen as well) possibly carry bits and pieces of Yemeny Jewish blood(IF they carry an ancestral name, and NOT a name change) through a small number of Sephardic immigrants from Spain and Italy and an even smaller number of Sephardic Jewish settlements in eastern Europe, BUT this is a very small minority of Hebraic blood, which absolutley has no influence on the Khazar flesh and bone ancestry, or their history. You can go to Birmingham's Grand central terminal and test the DnA of any native Brit you can find there and they'll have more Hebraic blood than any Khazar. There's no secret there. In order to keep their history accurate for future generations, the Ashkenazic community must not avoid or forget the fact that they are full blooded Central Asian/Slav/CaucasianIranoArmenian mixes, that their Yiddish language consists of Slavic, German, Turkic, and Mongol words, and that they carry on the religion of the Sephardic Spanish rabbis that converted them. Less than 500,000 Sephardic Jews managed to gather in Italy, Spain, and portugal, and with the black death and difficult living conditions, most real Jews got infected and died, either chose intermarriage in their host countries(Spain, Portugal, Italy) or chose isolate themselves into extinction, when compared to the 4 million Khazars that flooded Europe after Khazaria fell and created the modern European "Jewish" people. When the world finally learns the true origins of European Jews, there will be no war, no reason for occupation, and there will be peace on earth, free flowing beer and wine, and love making all over the place. The problem is propoganda, the history books suspiciously have only a few vague lines about Khazar history and a bunch of false stories and ridiculous fringe theories that have our Khazars descending from the 10 tribes, all made the incredible trip from the promise land to Europe, and bloomed from 500,000 to 4 million and more in few hundred years. If you have a half a brain, and you are able to think, you'll know something's not adding up. Like the Hungarians, Bulgarians, and the Turanian people of central Russia, they share direct blood with, they are "Mongrels!"

Schnozes, schnozes, yes, I wanted to get to Shnozes!

The Khazarian kingdom consisted of indigenous people in the area such as the causcasians sub groups Armenians and iranians, which gives some Khazars(a people with direct Mongol/Turanian ancestry) a false middle eastern look, big hook noses, dark skin and curly hair, when they are not a semetic people and a not related to Jews/seed of Abraham. To those that don't have a clue, there is a difference between caucasian and Arabic facial features that can be found in the structure of the nose. Caucasians native to the Khazar southern russian area such as Armenians and iranians have big noses, schnozes technically speaking, that have a tendency to hook downwards. Arabs do not have hook noses; their shnozes are big, but without the hook. The hook nose is a Caucasian trait found in the Armenians, iranians, southern European, celtic people and all Europeans. It makes blowing your nose a bitch with this big old knob at the end, but that's what you get when you're a CaucasianCelticSlavicLatinArmenianIranianAfghani.

I've studies this at every angle for years with educated unbiased people from all over the world... I was hit in the face with a Talmud in Kowloon 1986 and Louis Roth was on my side!-End of discussion!

Falkor, a friend was supposed to introduce me to Kwong Mei Bo in a 1986 private party in TsimST. The problem was my friend I were so pissed by the time she came, he was stumbling forwards and spouting dubb lines from Ninja Showdown, and I was stumbling backwards trying to pronounce Khazar. There's nothing like discussing political science to a rice bag with a hole when you're dead drunk. Charlie Cho changes sexual orientation twice after after a few Uzos and Scotches. You have to be ready to accept the visuals in these HK private parties Falkor.

Subgroups

The subclades of Haplogroup C3 with their defining mutation(s), according to the 2006 ISOGG tree:

C3 (M217, P44) Typical of Mongols, Kazakhs, and indigenous peoples of the Russian Far East

C3*

C3a (M93)

C3b (P39) Typical of the Na-Dené peoples of North America

C3c (M48, M77, M86)

C3d (M407)

Cheers!Tsogt Gombosuren!-Wan

[Guest wanchaitransient]

Frank send me or post your genetic markers that's listed on your DNA results. If you payed for a worthy DnA test, you should have 25 markers tested, that way we could accurately find out if you are related to Big Smooth Daddy Cool Ghengis Khan. Cheers-Wan.

[Guest thundered mantis]

Uhh what about Mirage of Martial Arts? I do not get a clue of what happens in the movie, as I have a tape dubbed in german, and I do not know a word of it, but it seems to me the protagonist travels to Mongolia or the like (the natives dance some sort of similar to russian dances, and they have competitions on horseback, some sort of rugby on horseback, being the ball a dead lamb, a bit like in Rambo 3).

Anyway, the movie is superb, 5/5 IMO

[Guest Frank Lakatos]

Mirage of Martial Arts, wow! That sounds great! I'll have to find that one asap, thanks for telling me about that!

Wan, I never knew about the entire history of the Khazars, just studied the little I had about it because of the propoganda. Thanks to you, we're one step ahead of learning about this mysterious people.

About my DnA records, whoaaa I'd don't think I'm related to Genghis! Man, I'm 90% white(I admit not the face structure, more like eastern, mongol set eyes and cheeks like my grandfather), I have blonde hair, blue eyes, I'm not Mongolian or Asian, just a regular white guy.

I looked for the records last night but, I looked everywhere but I couldn't find them. I didn't understand how to read and match the DnA so, out of frustration, I tossed the records aside and I probably threw them out with other papers I didn't need. I took this test in 2001 and I spent a month or two trying to figure it out with the help of the internet before I gave up on it. I wrote down the DnA number sequence on paper, which I still have, and every now and then I take it out whenever I find sites on DnA matching, but it's SO difficult to understand that I never get anywhere.

Frank

[Guest Frank Lakatos]

Wan, I found the paper with my DnA sequence. I'm not so sure what it means, but here goes:

DnA Y-chromosone segment\haplotype

393 13

390 25

19\394 16

391 10

385a 12

385b 13

426 12

388 14

439 10

389-l 13

392 11

389-ll 29

458 18

459a 8

459b 8

455 11

454 12

447 26

437 14

448 20

449 27

464a 11

464b 11

464c 12

464d 16

Frank

[Guest wanchaitransient]

Close, but no cigar! But CONGRATULATIONS anyhow, it's close and something you be proud of even though the Mongols were, along with the Turks, Hungary's historical enemies. Here's a stogie:smokin Let's put the history behind us my Mongol Hungarian American friend:

Your "Y" DnA sample:

393 13

390 25

19\394 16

391 10

385a 12

385b 13

426 12

388 14

439 10

389-l 13

392 11

389-ll 29

458 18

459a 8

459b 8

455 11

454 12

447 26

437 14

448 20

449 27

464a 11

464b 11

464c 12

464d 16

Genghis Khan's "Y" DnA sample:

DYS 393 13

DYS 390 25

DYS 19/394 16

DYS 391 10

DYS 385a 12

DYS 385b 13

DYS 426 11

DYS 388 14

DYS 439 10

DYS 389-1 13

DYS 392 11

DYS 389-2 29

DYS 458 18

DYS 459a 8

DYS 459b 8

DYS 455 11

DYS 454 12

DYS 447 26

DYS 437 14

DYS 448 22

DYS 449 27

DYS 464a 11

DYS 464b 11

DYS 464c 12

DYS 464d 16

You didn't directly descend from Big Smooth daddy Cool Genghis(your DYS 426 12 and DYS 448 20 differs from Ghengis's DYS 426 11 and DYS 448 22), but there's a chance that you might have descended from his brothers Kasar and Temuge or someone along the family lines. recently, a few DnA genealogy websites did some genetic testing on Big Smooth Daddy Cool Genghis, and you scored better than oneguy who was a few more shillings off than you, and he was the only Caucasian to have some relation to Genghis until he was proved wrong using a 25 marker test. He's in the same state as you so contact him if you can. As for how you picked up this gene, theories are just theories, but possibly one of your maternal ancestors was kidnapped and served to Genghis, and then the ancestor returned to your homeland, or one of Genghis's ancestors traveled along with one of the Tartar tribes and settled in Hungary, or one of Genghis's ancestors left his DnA during the first Mongol raid of Hungary. I suggest that you contact FamilyTree.com and have them send you a test in order to document your lineage, since they are searching for Genghis's modern heirs, which they haven't found yet. They may have a cigar for you as well.

Frank, send me over you maternal ancestor's names and the exact locations of your ancestors, and it could tell the story better. Did you ever have something called the Mongolian Spot?

You wouldn't mind If I called you "Mongol Frank?" Cheers bradda!-Wan

[Guest Frank Lakatos]

Wow Wan!:eek :eek If it is true and confirmed that I had descended Genghis Khan's empire, well that's the best news I've ever heard! When I get the money, I'd like to take another DnA test, probably from more than one Dna tester, just to filter out any mistakes and doubts that I have. I read that Robinson blog about how the DnA testers had left out some DnA sequences, so I'd like to make sure that my DnA test is done any error. For the time being, I know for sure that I have Mongolian blood running in me as my Y-DnA is of the Haplogroup C-3, so I have much to learn about my Mongolian ancestors and DnA testing before I go further into these tests.

"Frank, send me over you maternal ancestor's names and the exact locations of your ancestors, and it could tell the story better. Did you ever have something called the Mongolian Spot?"

My Hungarian descendants, from both sides of the family, come from Baranya southern Hungary. From what I understand, the last name Lakatos is not my real surname. Why the name change, I am not too sure, but i know it happened a hundred years ago. The family story is that one of my great great great grandfathers settled in Hungarian/Croatian border town with Besenyo Hungarians, and my great great great grandfather and the Besenyos in that town took the Gypsy name Lakatos, probably because the Besenyo were of Kun origin, they were darker than the usual Hungarians, as the Besenyo were known to mix with the gypsy populations, it had something to do with that.

My original paternal surname was Szente. My mother is American, but my grandparents are immigrants. My mother is half Hungarian, half Polish, her maiden name is Illes and her mother's name is Jakubowicz. My Polish grandmother is from Bohoniki, Poland.

About the Mongol spot, it's a birthmark, and I have one on my left buttuck, light blueish grey in color that and it has seemed to fade over the years. When I used to get shots there, the nurses would always tell me about a bruise there, and I didn't know or care what they were talking about, and that's what it was.

"You wouldn't mind If I called you "Mongol Frank?" Cheers bradda!-Wan"

Sounds interesting. I might change my screen name to that. It's better than same old "Frank Lakatos" user name, it makes the forum boring.

Wan, thanks for all of your help with the DnA and all. You've solved 5 years of a mystery. I've been to genealogy forums, and nobody really knew what I had, so this DnA subject is quite important to me. Thanks, and thanks to all for putting up with my nonsense!

Frank

[Guest Shaolin Dog Paw]

this has all been interesting to read. thanks guys.

Frank, heres some reccommendations:

Attila

Proud Horse in Flying Sand

The Red and the White

The Fierce One

The Herdsman

Ballad of the Yellow River

Kekexili