Member DAJIZZARIZZA Posted August 10, 2009 Member Share Posted August 10, 2009 daisho2004 said: When Beat Takeshi remade his version of Zatoichi everyone hated it! But I really enjoyed it very different take on him. His Zatoichi was more ruthless, Killed you in the Blink of an Eye! But it did have some of the old elements of the Old Zatoichi movies. ok,.. i finally sat down and made myself watch this film,.. and i promised you Daisho i would give you my take on it. Daisho,.. this was a MAJOR surprize for me ,.. i normally have a problem with when i get use to a actor or actress that dominates a role,.. when they are replaced it's hard for me to give a new face a try at that role. Well brother you were 100% right on this movie,.. whoever did not enjoy this film ,.. is a straight movie novice and need not to speak on anything again regarding japanese movies. not only did they mix the emotion element to a perfection (action/drama/music/comedy/mystery) they added ART to this film,.. the director was a genious,.. fight scenes were flawless !!,... they cast the right people for the right parts,... and my goodness ZATOICHI was awesome !!! only 2 flaws with this movie ,.. no three. 1. it ended too soon for me ,.. i could had seen another hour worth of film,... i mean it had me not wanting to let this film go,.. sorry it ended. 2.no sequel ??? lol well they opened and completly finished this movie ,.. not really room for a sequel,.. but damn i would hat used that actor again for a series of movies. 3. this is a real almost negative,.. Zatoichi did very little talking ,.. which always disallows a viewer to really build a connection to the actor. // then again ,.i'm very sure the director did not want the viewer to connect with Zatoichi,.. he wanted Zato to be a mystery even to us who thought we knew this man ,.. due to the old films. He was not a hero ,.. he was the GRIM REAPER !!! wicked film !!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member daisho2004 Posted August 10, 2009 Member Share Posted August 10, 2009 DAJIZZARIZZA: I told you! I really enjoyed this one, and I agree with everything you said. I was hoping he was going to make a sequel and there was rumors that he was! But I don't know what happened! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DAJIZZARIZZA Posted August 10, 2009 Author Member Share Posted August 10, 2009 i watched again ,. just to be certain it was not just late night enjoyment,.. lol it was a great movie,.. can't believe i forgot to give props to the special effects crew and production team. this is an example of everyone from every team ,.. DOING A FLAWLESS JOB. I hope this film gathered enough awards,.. sorry it took me 6 years to watch this film thanks for encouraging me Daisho ,. to finally give it a try,.. and big thanks to Kungfu bob for supplying me with the movie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member daisho2004 Posted August 11, 2009 Member Share Posted August 11, 2009 DAJIZZARIZZA: No problem glad you liked it... You should look at the Samurai movies & sequels that I started at the top of this page there are some excellent Samurai/Ninja movies that I'm sure you haven't even seen or heard of! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator KUNG FU BOB Posted August 11, 2009 Administrator Share Posted August 11, 2009 thanks for encouraging me Daisho ,. to finally give it a try,.. and big thanks to Kungfu bob for supplying me with the movie. My pleasure bro. My only complaint was that pitiful CGI blood. That really distracted me during the action. I thought it looked terrible. But I really liked the movie otherwise. DAJIZZARIZZA: No problem glad you liked it... You should look at the Samurai movies & sequels that I started at the top of this page there are some excellent Samurai/Ninja movies that I'm sure you haven't even seen or heard of! Daisho2004- don't think that just because Dajizzarizza took so long to watch this movie that he's not up on his chanbara. This cat has seen shit that I'll bet you've never heard of! And I know you are very well-versed on the genre and have a great collection too. Brother D has turned me on to a lot of great films that I had no idea even existed (and has never let me down) in our many trades. You guys should each make a list of rare stuff you've seen- just to compare. I'm sure you'd both benefit from that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member daisho2004 Posted August 11, 2009 Member Share Posted August 11, 2009 Thanks KFB! I haven't had a chance to make up my list yet, that is my future project soon! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DAJIZZARIZZA Posted August 11, 2009 Author Member Share Posted August 11, 2009 yeah,.. i noticed the cgi blood as well, but it was very well done KFB ,.. what would look better ? goats blood ? ,..lol the cgi blood was prob the only way he could do those realistic severs ,.. like when ZATO SLICED THROUGH THE BAMBOO ,..cutting off the dudes' thumb or when he SLICED THE DICE DEALER'S ARM ,.. oooohhhh ,..lol over all this film was tight KFB,..how do you let animated blood deter the experiance you could had really enjoyed. i'm far from an expert in this genre,.. i was put on to it just about a year or 2 ago by Bejing Video,. good guy. anyway,. i collected alot and learned alot of interesting facts in order to know what i'm talking about when i open my yippty yap,..lol have a great day peeps and thanks again to both of you guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WuxiaFan Posted August 11, 2009 Share Posted August 11, 2009 Beat's ZATOICHI has always been one of my all time favorites. I thought Beat protrayed Ichi extremely well! What I liked was that it was in the same vein as Katsu, but different at the same time. That is, Beat was not trying to just DO Katsu, if that makes any sense. Another reason I love this movie was that the movie made its way to Madison, WI in 2004 so I got to see it (several times, BTW) on the big screen. It was incredible! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member masterofoneinchpunch Posted August 11, 2009 Member Share Posted August 11, 2009 Beat's ZATOICHI has always been one of my all time favorites. I thought Beat protrayed Ichi extremely well! What I liked was that it was in the same vein as Katsu, but different at the same time. That is, Beat was not trying to just DO Katsu, if that makes any sense. Another reason I love this movie was that the movie made its way to Madison, WI in 2004 so I got to see it (several times, BTW) on the big screen. It was incredible! I'm glad Takashi went with his own approach to Zatoichi. I actually didn't like the last Katsu Zatoichi (I felt his ego was just too big; bigger than Hanzo's). Beat had a little fun with the genre towards the end with his character, but always within the realms of Zatoichi's universe. His laconic approach I thought worked quite well. What an ending to this film though . That took me a bit by surprise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator KUNG FU BOB Posted August 11, 2009 Administrator Share Posted August 11, 2009 yeah,.. i noticed the cgi blood as well, but it was very well done KFB ,.. what would look better ? goats blood ? ,..lol the cgi blood was prob the only way he could do those realistic severs ,.. like when ZATO SLICED THROUGH THE BAMBOO ,..cutting off the dudes' thumb or when he SLICED THE DICE DEALER'S ARM ,.. oooohhhh ,..lol over all this film was tight KFB,..how do you let animated blood deter the experiance you could had really enjoyed. I did think the severs through the bodies looked good, but the CGI blood was just so fake looking that it was like getting slapped in the face in the middle of each other-wise awesome action scene- in other words- very distracting! Maybe it's because I'm an amateur special makeup effects artist myself- so I knew it could have looked so much better. The CGI blood is easier on the filmmakers as they don't have to hide blood tubing or worry about blood splattered costumes, actors, sets, and props if they need a second or third take. So I get why they do it, but I thought it was stupid in a great film. Like Dean Shek in... well, take your pick. When they used the CGI blood in KILTRO it worked for me because that film was very tongue-in--cheek, so it fit right in. Another reason I love this movie was that the movie made its way to Madison, WI in 2004 so I got to see it (several times, BTW) on the big screen. It was incredible! Nice! You lucky dog you. What an ending to this film though . That took me a bit by surprise. Same here! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Tosh Posted August 12, 2009 Member Share Posted August 12, 2009 Saw this in the theater aswell. The movie was good, Beat made an excellent Zatoichi and the rest of the cast was topnotch but I had a couple problems with it, one being the cgi blood as KFBob explained, I could of also done without the 9 year old boy dressed like a woman dance scene that seemed to drag on for 10 minutes, funny thing is I'm a big fan of Kabuki and Noh through these movies but all the dance scenes irked me a bit for some reason. I do tend to be critical when it comes to a character that I have so much invested interest in, seeing I've watched around 90% of Zatoichi movies/tv shows. It was faithful to the character and that gets my respect, I'd like to see what he could do with another one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DAJIZZARIZZA Posted August 12, 2009 Author Member Share Posted August 12, 2009 I did think the severs through the bodies looked good, but the CGI blood was just so fake looking that it was like getting slapped in the face in the middle of each other-wise awesome action scene- in other words- very distracting! Maybe it's because I'm an amateur special makeup effects artist myself- so I knew it could have looked so much better.! ok,.. here is your problem with films Kungfubob ,.. YOU KNOW TOO DAMN MUCH !!!! lol,... 1st you know martail arts,.. 2nd you know sword-play,.. now you even know the insides of special effects,.. lol,.. how can you enjoy AZUMI,.. or ZATOICHI,.. i feel sorry for you . guess what ? Ignorance IS bliss,..lol i can't watch a jackie chan or even the 1960's Batman ,.. around my lil sister ,.. she will pick it apart,.. she sees all the tricks ,.. all the damn wires,.. she can tell this ,.. she can see that,.. i go nuts,.. FORCE YOURSELF TO WATCH THE MOVIE WITH NOVICE EYES,.. then you will see the beauty in what they are trying to do. yes i said BATMAN 1960'S ,..LOL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member daisho2004 Posted August 12, 2009 Member Share Posted August 12, 2009 At 1st. the CGI Blood was a little hard to get use to but I really liked it! The Action scenes were good! Here is my Question was he Blind or not? At the end of the movie he said even with my eyes open I still cannot see? Hello I'm always lost with that part! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator KUNG FU BOB Posted August 13, 2009 Administrator Share Posted August 13, 2009 ok,.. here is your problem with films Kungfubob ,.. YOU KNOW TOO DAMN MUCH !!!! lol,... FORCE YOURSELF TO WATCH THE MOVIE WITH NOVICE EYES,.. then you will see the beauty in what they are trying to do. LMAO! Hey D, there's plenty I don't know about- computers, cars, politics, and why people WOULD EVER eat brussel sprouts! For the most part, I do get totally immersed in films. My one friend went with me to the movies and he said he never saw anyone look more swept away by a movie (and that film was only so so). I'm typically very good at suspending my disbelief, and it's rare when something really irks me like that CGI blood. But it just so happens to be movies that we keep discussing! At 1st. the CGI Blood was a little hard to get use to but I really liked it! The Action scenes were good! Here is my Question was he Blind or not? At the end of the movie he said even with my eyes open I still cannot see? Hello I'm always lost with that part! Yeah, I wasn't sure either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WuxiaFan Posted August 13, 2009 Share Posted August 13, 2009 LMAO! Hey D, there's plenty I don't know about- computers, cars, politics, and why people WOULD EVER eat brussel sprouts! I LOVE brussel sprouts! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator KUNG FU BOB Posted August 13, 2009 Administrator Share Posted August 13, 2009 I LOVE brussel sprouts! When I do my Sonny Chiba impersonation- to truly channel that mad energy- I always imagine my enemy will feed me brussel sprouts if they defeat me! That helps a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DAJIZZARIZZA Posted August 14, 2009 Author Member Share Posted August 14, 2009 do you realize you guys are nuts ,..lol not dignified likes mys self ,.. hahaaahaha i liked those demon eyes he had ,.. by the way ,.. tap dance is not a japanese art ,.. but the big tap scene at the end was nice to see ,.. it shows all of us humans are very much alike. it was a pleasure to watch,.. i won't keep this thread going,.. but next film i'm checking out will be a female ninja movie ,.. which i will not disclose at this time. ancient japanese secret !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member daisho2004 Posted August 14, 2009 Member Share Posted August 14, 2009 DAJIZZARIZZA: you have to tell us which movie it is you'll be watching next house rules! lol:tongue: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator One Armed Boxer Posted January 19, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 19, 2014 I just got through watching this one having been on a bit of Beat Takeshi kick lately. Interestingly it looks like I'm the first person to contribute to this thread who's doing so from the perspective of being a Takeshi fan rather than a Zatoichi one. No doubt this will draw gasps of disdain from the guys who frequent this area of the forum, but I've actually never seen a Zatoichi movie before this one, something that I do plan to amend at some point. My Takeshi kick started when I introduced my friend to his latest movies through a double bill movie night of 'Outrage' & 'Outrage: Beyond'. It struck me that despite having lived in Japan from 2008 - 2012 when I saw Takeshi almost every day on the TV, as part of the topical news show he co-presents, I hadn't bothered with his movies due to some misaligned expectations I'd had when first exploring the whole Asian movie world. Around 2000, I bought a Beat Takeshi boxset which contained 'Violent Cop', 'Boiling Point', & 'Sonatine'. Billed on the box as a Japanese version of John Woo, and having recently viewed Woo's HK works in all their bullet ridden glory, I settled town to watch 'Violent Cop' basically expecting a Japanese version of 'The Killer'. Of course what I got was something not even remotely close to Woo, and I was so annoyed I never even bothered to watch the other movies in the box. Skip forward to today 14 years later, & after enjoying his latest yakuza movies, I decided it was time to give 'Violent Cop' another shot. Surprisingly, I loved it. The dark humor, the sudden bursts of violence, Takeshi's deadpan performance, it all worked perfectly. I followed it with finally watching 'Sonatine', which just so happens to have probably worked its way into my top 10 favorite movies of all time I thought it was that good. So, today I decided to skip forward and give 'Zatoichi' a shot, a DVD which had been given to me as a present many many years ago, but I'd never even bothered to put in my DVD player. 'Zatoichi' is obviously a very different beast than 'Violent Cop' & 'Sonatine', not least because there's a more than 10 year gap between them and the fact that they're completely different genres, but still Takeshi always seems to put a lot of himself into his characters. There are traces of his slightly psychotic cop character from 'Violent Cop' & the world weary yakuza from 'Sonatine' in Takeshi's version of 'Zatoichi', however unlike those movies, here he seems to perform as part of a bigger ensemble, with a lot of screentime dedicated to other characters as well. Personally I would have preferred to have more Takeshi onscreen, but then it could be argued he wouldn't seem as enigmatic as he did if this was the case. What did bother me in the movie, and I'm not sure if it's just because the technology wasn't there in 2003, was the CGI blood and decapitated limbs. It looked sub-par and cheap, completely destroying what are otherwise intense bursts of violent swordplay. It was so bad that when Zatoichi first impales someone through the back with his sword, the exit wound of the sword coming out of the back is CGI & it actually moves a little, like someone is using a mouse to drag it into position. This completely destroyed the scene for me. Thankfully the story is a strong one, so even though the bursts of violence end up serving as distractions rather than punctuations, our attention is still held. Takeshi always injects his trademark black humor in various places, from a scene were he has a pair of eyes painted on his eye lids, to the final shot and line of the movie, which reminded me of the ending to 'Outrage: Beyond', in that it also made me laugh out loud. All in all a good movie, but I think I enjoy his yakuza works more. Next up, 'Boiling Point' & 'Hana-Bi'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Takuma Posted January 19, 2014 Member Share Posted January 19, 2014 I think around the time the film came out many of use were either too young, or just too blind, to pay much attention to the CGI. That certainly was the case with me when I first saw the film at the tender age of 17... Now that I look at the film the CGI blood looks just goddamn awful. Hana-Bi is perhaps Kitano's greatest masterpiece! In fact, I can't decide beween Hana-Bi or Sonatine. Sonatine is by far the most genius yakuza film ever made, but Hana-Bi is perfection from the first frame to the last. Kid's Return, and especially A Scene at the Sea, are also absolutely magnificent. His semi-recent comedies, Takeshis' and Glory to the Filmmaker, are best forgotten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member smilebomb Posted January 20, 2014 Member Share Posted January 20, 2014 For those of us who grew up in the 80s or early 90s, the CGI is incredibly obvious and offputting. The guy who accused someone of nitpicking posted years ago, but yeah. Anyway, this is a weird, uneven film. It was made in a period of Kitano's life where no one would dare question him on anything, so he thought he could do no wrong. Near the end of the movie I still couldn't tell you whether it was a drama or a comedy, or what the hell the plot was about. Violent Cop is one of the most unique films I've ever seen. Like most genuinely unique things, marketing can only hurt it. It's more like an impressionistic, Godard-directed Dirty Harry than anything John Woo related. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator KUNG FU BOB Posted January 20, 2014 Administrator Share Posted January 20, 2014 Interestingly it looks like I'm the first person to contribute to this thread who's doing so from the perspective of being a Takeshi fan rather than a Zatoichi one. It may seem so, but I was indeed a fan of Beat as well as Zatoichi when I saw the film. And I was very excited to see what such a gifted filmmaker/actor would do with the character. No doubt this will draw gasps of disdain from the guys who frequent this area of the forum, but I've actually never seen a Zatoichi movie before this one, something that I do plan to amend at some point. Um, "gasps"? I actually hyperventilated and passed out bro. I know I shouldn't be shocked, as we all have something we haven't caught up with yet, but I still was. Holy... brother, you're in for a great ride when you finally check out the original Zatoichi films. Around 2000, I bought a Beat Takeshi boxset which contained 'Violent Cop', 'Boiling Point', & 'Sonatine'. Billed on the box as a Japanese version of John Woo, and having recently viewed Woo's HK works in all their bullet ridden glory, I settled town to watch 'Violent Cop' basically expecting a Japanese version of 'The Killer'. Of course what I got was something not even remotely close to Woo, and I was so annoyed I never even bothered to watch the other movies in the box. Yes, those descriptions were incredibly misleading. Back in the day, after seeing and loving a couple of his films, I invited some friends over to watch SONATINE (1993). I explained the sort of film it would be, and they seemed game. But when the gangsters were laying low and hanging out at the beach my friends began to shift about with boredom. The general consensus was that it was " Really boring with a minute or two that were good". Most of them would never watch another Beat film after that, no matter how fantastic I told them it was. Skip forward to today 14 years later, & after enjoying his latest yakuza movies, I decided it was time to give 'Violent Cop' another shot. Surprisingly, I loved it. The dark humor, the sudden bursts of violence, Takeshi's deadpan performance, it all worked perfectly. I followed it with finally watching 'Sonatine', which just so happens to have probably worked its way into my top 10 favorite movies of all time I thought it was that good. Glad to hear you're a fan now. Personally I would have preferred to have more Takeshi onscreen, but then it could be argued he wouldn't seem as enigmatic as he did if this was the case. Same here. I wanted more of Zatoichi. Otherwise, the film might've been better off being called ZATOICHI AND THE TOWNSPEOPLE. What did bother me in the movie, and I'm not sure if it's just because the technology wasn't there in 2003, was the CGI blood and decapitated limbs. It looked sub-par and cheap, completely destroying what are otherwise intense bursts of violent swordplay. It was so bad that when Zatoichi first impales someone through the back with his sword, the exit wound of the sword coming out of the back is CGI & it actually moves a little, like someone is using a mouse to drag it into position. This completely destroyed the scene for me. Mm-hm. Where's George Lucas and his touch-ups when we need him? If these effects were sub-par, that's one thing. But they were truly terrible. All in all a good movie, but I think I enjoy his yakuza works more. Next up, 'Boiling Point' & 'Hana-Bi'. You'll dig them. I am especially looking forward to hearing what you think of HANA-BI. I think around the time the film came out many of use were either too young, or just too blind, to pay much attention to the CGI. That certainly was the case with me when I first saw the film at the tender age of 17... Now that I look at the film the CGI blood looks just goddamn awful. When it came out I had already seen much better digital blood in films, so it was even more irritating. Knowing that it could've been done better. Perhaps the most annoying aspect of this situation is that of all things, injuries and cut-throughs could benefit greatly from CGI enhancement. I'd always thought that using FX technology to show blades actually cutting through bodies, complimented with practical blood effects, would be a fantastic idea. But I rarely see it used properly (IMHO). Hana-Bi is perhaps Kitano's greatest masterpiece! In fact, I can't decide beween Hana-Bi or Sonatine. Sonatine is by far the most genius yakuza film ever made, but Hana-Bi is perfection from the first frame to the last. Well said. Kid's Return, and especially A Scene at the Sea, are also absolutely magnificent. His semi-recent comedies, Takeshis' and Glory to the Filmmaker, are best forgotten. I haven't seen any of these yet. For those of us who grew up in the 80s or early 90s, the CGI is incredibly obvious and offputting. The guy who accused someone of nitpicking posted years ago, but yeah. I'm the one that was accused of nitpicking. Anyway, this is a weird, uneven film. It was made in a period of Kitano's life where no one would dare question him on anything, so he thought he could do no wrong. Near the end of the movie I still couldn't tell you whether it was a drama or a comedy, or what the hell the plot was about. Good point. It definitely had a little bit of HEAVEN'S GATE* syndrome to it for me as well. I don't mind a film mixing up genres like that, but I still found it entertaining but "off" a bit. Violent Cop is one of the most unique films I've ever seen. Like most genuinely unique things, marketing can only hurt it. It's more like an impressionistic, Godard-directed Dirty Harry than anything John Woo related. Great description. * For those not familiar with the film HEAVEN'S GATE or it's back story, it's director Michael Cimino had just come off the triumph of the classic film THE DEER HUNTER. The studio was eager to please this newly award-winning director and famously allowed him to go crazy in a most self indulgent way when filming his follow up western drama. Though much maligned, the film, despite being overly long and by no means a classic, is not bad. It even occasionally shines in a most magnificent way. Ultimately the bad publicity resulting from the over-budget film had a negative effect on it's box office and probably from some "jump on the bash it bandwagon" of many reviewers. It was recently released by Criterion and is well worth a look. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DrNgor Posted July 29, 2022 Member Share Posted July 29, 2022 I finally got around to watching this. Here's my review: https://abeautifulfilm.blogspot.com/2022/07/zatoichi-2003.html 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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