Kung Fu-David Carradine(and other cool 70's/80's classic series)

[Chinatown Kid]

Anybody a fan of the old KF tv series starring David Carradine as Kwai Chang Caine? I thought this show was way ahead of it's time with some great acting. The show set in the 1800's american West also delved into interesting Asian/Buddhist philosophies and was unique in that it had a hero who was humble and gentle, but could defend himself and protect others when he had to using the skills he learned in the Shaolin Temple. Carradine wasn't much of a martial artist but did alright job in the fight scenes, he did have great acting ability though that brought the character of Caine to life with just the right touch. Other great regulars such as Phillip Ahn as Master Kan and the unforgettable Keye Luke as the blind Master Po also helped to make this series legendary. I own the three season set from Warner Brothers and love to pop in some episodes in my player from time to time to see the great acting, atmosphere, and kernals of wisdom that Caine has learned from his time at the temple. David Chow and latter Kam Yuen did a respectable job with the fight scenes on the show. Everyone knows that Bruce was turned down for the role of Caine, reportedly because of racism or they questoned Lee's acting ability. Actually i think Bruce would have been wrong for this role with his fire and machismo, they needed someone mellow like David and the role seemed to fit him to a tee.

[The Dragon]

They probably never saw Bruce after a couple of his "Brownies" Linda made for him.

[Chinatown Kid]

lol, Dragon you got me wanting to try some of those "brownies"

[teako170]

Anybody a fan of the old KF tv series starring David Carradine as Kwai Chang Caine?

I have a lengthy interview (early 80s) he did for a zine about the TV series and a planned film ...

(which I think got made but not until the mid/late 80s?).

Anyhow if you like CK, I'll scan and post for you.

[Chinatown Kid]

I have a lengthy interview (early 80s) he did for a zine about the TV series and a planned film ...

(which I think got made but not until the mid/late 80s?).

Anyhow if you like CK, I'll scan and post for you.

If you could whenever you get the time that would be great T, much appreciated.

[teako170]

If you could whenever you get the time that would be great T, much appreciated.

Here's the first half. Will get the other half up later...

[Chinatown Kid]

Very interesting interview of Carradine's thoughts and perspective on the show, again much thanks Teako. I'll be looking forward to reading the rest of the interview when you get a chance to post it.

[KUNG FU BOB]

You know, I was always down on this show because I thought Bruce got dissed over it, so I never watched it. My Dad used to put it on, and I always left the room. But as I got older, I realized that due to it's subject matter it was a radical show for it's time, and an important element in the genre I love most. So one day I saw all 3 seasons on DVD, for sale for around $40.00 (a steal!), and I picked them up.

I really wanted to like it. But I thought Carradine's acting was absolutely awful! The worst "broken English" BS I've ever heard. I was shocked to see the Shaolin temple stuff, and how authentic they strived to be. But as soon as he would start talking- or fighting- my eyes would start rolling up into my head!

I really like Carradine in everthing else I've seen him in- THE LONG RIDERS, DEATH RACE 2000, BOXCAR BERTHA, KILL BILL- but I felt like I just couldn't stomach him in this. I plan on giving it another shot- I mean, damn, I bought the whole freakin series- but... I don't know when... It seems like more of a horrible chore than entertainment after that first dose.

Does it get better after a few episodes?

[KyFi]

Anybody a fan of the old KF tv series starring David Carradine as Kwai Chang Caine? I thought this show was way ahead of it's time with some great acting. The show set in the 1800's american West also delved into interesting Asian/Buddhist philosophies and was unique in that it had a hero who was humble and gentle, but could defend himself and protect others when he had to using the skills he learned in the Shaolin Temple. Carradine wasn't much of a martial artist but did alright job in the fight scenes, he did have great acting ability though that brought the character of Caine to life with just the right touch. Other great regulars such as Phillip Ahn as Master Kan and the unforgettable Keye Luke as the blind Master Po also helped to make this series legendary. I own the three season set from Warner Brothers and love to pop in some episodes in my player from time to time to see the great acting, atmosphere, and kernals of wisdom that Caine has learned from his time at the temple. David Chow and latter Kam Yuen did a respectable job with the fight scenes on the show. Everyone knows that Bruce was turned down for the role of Caine, reportedly because of racism or they questoned Lee's acting ability. Actually i think Bruce would have been wrong for this role with his fire and machismo, they needed someone mellow like David and the role seemed to fit him to a tee.

I pretty much agree with you, Chinatown Kid. This is one of my first memories of a TV show (along with Ultraman) that I saw as a kid---I was 5 or 6 when it came out. I still remember being the envy of 1st grade with my metal Kung Fu lunchbox! I hadn't really seen the show since it first ran, and then I got used to seeing Carradine in a bunch of schlock in the 80's and 90's (like the lame sequel to this series). I picked up the first season of this on DVD, not sure how much I'd like it, and to my surprise it held up REALLY well. Very classy, creative, complex plotlines and themes. A couple things I like about the show is that it didn't deal with simplistic stereotypes---the white people that Caine came across were a broad spectrum---some were racist and intolerant, some treated him indifferently, and some treated him very kindly and respectfully. And also, I like that in the episodes that show the Chinese immigrant community, Caine is just as much of an outsider there as he is with the white community---his character was really just a unique guy, not really fitting in anywhere. Sure, the show did go a bit overboard at times with Carradine's spacy, 70's spiritual vibe, but that was what they were pretty much shooting for. Carradine was no great shakes as a martial artist, but the fight scenes were filmed pretty creatively, IMO---I dig the slo-mo stuff. And I totally agree that, given the plots and nature of this character, Carradine works much better than Bruce Lee would have. Maybe the fact that Carradine WASN'T such a great martial artist made them focus more on making him an interesting character in complex situations. If Bruce was in the lead, I think it would have most likely been more of a straight-ahead action show (not that I wouldn't want to see that as well!). But who knows.

But anyways, yes, I think this is a very cool, unique, creative show, especially for its time.

[Chinatown Kid]

I agree with your comments on the show as well KyFi, thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[KUNG FU BOB]

Hey Chinatown Kid, just so you know, I wasn't trying to rain on your parade. I don't like when people go to a thread on a subject they hate, just to act obnoxious. I was serious when I asked if it got better.

Oh, and I must agree with you guys about Bruce being wrong for the role.

[Chinatown Kid]

Oh I understand Bob, everybody doesn't have the same tastes or likes and you have just as much right to state your opinion as the rest of us. If you didn't like the first few episodes you probably won't like the rest of the series either, some people just don't like it. Carradine's martial art skills did improve a little bit as the show went on, but the fights were just ok imo. I just like the fact that he did use MA in the series which was rare for an American tv show at the time. And I just loved the flavor of the show and the idea of this humble hero who carried no gun but defended himself against the lawless old west villains and used a Eastern type philosophy he was taught in the Shaolin Temple to deal with the problems he faced. Each episode taught a little bit of wisdom for the viewer to digest. Just my feelings on the series, and I respect your view of the show as well.

[The Dragon]

Does it get better after a few episodes?

Hell No.

I feel had Bruce been in it, it wouldn't have even been what it turned out to be but better. He had a way of influencing his projects, and the whole Shaolin Temple aspect definetly would have been more authentic.

The fight choreographer, I forget his name, wasn't allowed to utilize very much of the "Eastern Arts" to really give audiences that jolt. The Western stuntmen all thought it was B.S. Bruce would have shown them, just as he did on Green Hornet. If you ask me, I believe that's what's missing in today's action cinema, no one wants to challenge themselves, and everyone keeps repeating or ripping off what's already been done. Even when watching Woo Ping or Siu Tung's choreography, you say "That's Siu Tung, or, That's Woo Ping!"

[dionbrother]

Actually, the series gets much better in the second and third season. The action improves, and some episodes get into the mystical trippy hippy wackiness. One episode with Carradine fighting Robert Ito (as a Tong Leader) is a stunningly good fight that is amazing for tv and could hold up with the average Hong Kong movies of the time. Bruce was never involved with the show. At all. It's an urban legend that never went away. He was once suggested as a technical adviser, but that's it. Bruce was too good for tv.

The fight choreographer in the first season was David Chow who had Caine doing mostly judo, the superior seasons two and three were done by Kam Yuen.

[teako170]

Gast, Peter. "The Second Coming of Kung Fu." Martial Arts Movies Jan. 1982: 18-27.

[KyFi]

Thanks for posting those, teako!

I do really appreciate the show, but I have to take a bit of exception to Carradine saying "the only time kung fu has ever worked on film was in the Kung Fu tv series."

If he had said that in 1973, MAYBE you could cut him some slack, but in 1982? I would have to think he either hadn't seen or didn't understand Liu Chia Liang's work.

[Chinatown Kid]

Yes thanks for posting the rest of the interview Mr. T, interesting read. Yeah KyFi I've read alot of stuff Carradine has said that's complete bullshit but he's definately an interesting character lol.

[The Dragon]

Never cared for him.

:l

[Chinatown Kid]

I kinda already figured that Dragon lol. You know I think Carradine might've been able to take Bruce Lee though.....

[KUNG FU BOB]

I kinda already figured that Dragon lol. You know I think Carradine might've been able to take Bruce Lee though.....

If you don't catch a Dragon with that bait I'll be stunned! XD

[Chinatown Kid]

Now you didn't let me finish Bob, I meant he could take Bruce out to dinner back then and tell him how much better a Martial Artist Bruce was then him.

[The Dragon]

... You know I think Carradine might've been able to take Bruce Lee though...

:l

Lol.

[Killer Meteor]

The fight choreographer in the first season was David Chow who had Caine doing mostly judo, the superior seasons two and three were done by Kam Yuen.

Interestingly, some old film books give Bruce Lee's birthname as Yuen Kam.

[Tosh]

I rented the first one when this came out, I'm at that age where this was the next best thing to a good Shaw movie as you was going to get on tv back in BC (before cable), so it's definitely some nostalgia but I think it was the mix of Kung Fu with Western that really makes this work(for me anyway), it had a good message and turned a lot of Westerners in the 70's to Chinese and Zen philosophies.

The extras showed the casting problems that arised, the Asian actors wanted a Asian person in the role understandably, the problem with Bruce as stated was his broken English, all in all I thought Carradine did a good job(and hell for years I thought he was half Asian) but one of the main producers did not want or like his cocky attitude. I think it would of been a waste of time and talent for Bruce anyway.

One thing that always bothered me was Caine's teenager, he looked nothing like Carradine and I never understood why they just wouldn't of had Carradine play that role himself. One thing is for sure, I'll have that opening sequence and music burnt in my mind forever, kind of like the original Star Trek I watched the repeats over and over.

[Chinatown Kid]

I first saw Caine in the reruns they played every afternoon back in the 80's, I'd watch it everyday after school and the opening sequence to the show is burnt in my mind forever as well Tosh. The only other 2 shows to do this from my childhood that are the same way are The Six Million Dollar Man and The Incredible Hulk, remember those shows Tosh?