Member Secret Executioner Posted February 9, 2014 Member Share Posted February 9, 2014 Haven't seen this one, but this thread is such a fine and interesting read (I especially like the analysis provided by Cold Bishop a couple of messages above) that I now want to see it. Funny that neither the title nor some artworks (that VHS cover posted earlier) have anything to do with the film, but I came to expect that with MA movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Secret Executioner Posted February 9, 2014 Member Share Posted February 9, 2014 And I agree with what some said, I checked out the hkcinemagic entry on this one and the plot sounds similar to that of Bruce Lee's The Big Boss. Concerning Shaolin Martial Arts (that was mentionned early in the thread), is it a 1974 Chang Cheh movie partially distributed by Chang Cheh's company you were talking about ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Killer Meteor Posted February 9, 2014 Member Share Posted February 9, 2014 While I'm not usually the biggest fan of Chiang Tao as a main villain (and even Fung Hak-On could get pretty damn repetitive), I think it works here. I think these two work out great in the Iron Triangle and Shaolin Cycle. Chiang Tao must hold records in my book for the lamest death scene ever (slowwwwwwly being tapped to death by Ti Lung in Blood Brothers) and the most painful death scene ever (slowwwwwly and noicely convulsing to death in Shaolin Martial Arts). Lu Ti, after doing nothing in Shaolin Martial Arts, really impressed in films like The Delinquent and Iron Bodyguard - he was very fast and ferocious in those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted February 9, 2014 Member Share Posted February 9, 2014 LOL at that cover. Looks like J-Lo failed attempt at Gravity the sequel.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member teako170 Posted February 9, 2014 Member Share Posted February 9, 2014 Nice analysis Cold Bishop. The way CKC extracted revenge on Lu Ti was perfect. A poster I dug up. Good ol' Northal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Secret Executioner Posted February 9, 2014 Member Share Posted February 9, 2014 Very nice poster, teako. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Cold Bishop Posted February 9, 2014 Member Share Posted February 9, 2014 Concerning Shaolin Martial Arts (that was mentionned early in the thread), is it a 1974 Chang Cheh movie partially distributed by Chang Cheh's company you were talking about ?Yeah, the third film of the Shaolin Cycle, after Men from the Monastery and before Five Shaolin Masters. I'll actually go to bat for Shaolin Martial Arts as one of my favorites of the series. I came to it late because of its utter lack of reputation, but the movie passed well beyond my expectations. This, and not Five Shaolin Masters, is where Shapes begin. You not only have the choreography, but the entire structure is the classic "Kung Fu Cycle" of lose/train/fight/win that became pretty much gospel in the genre. Gordon Liu, Johnny Wang and Leung Kar-Yen all make their proper debuts here, and even veteran Simon Yuen here seems to develop the curmudgeonly kung-fu master schtick that would become his bread and butter over the next few years. The focus on training and student-teacher dynamics are in place a whole two years before Challenge of the Masters, which is suppose to be the film that really inspired all the imitators. Speaking of which, this more than any other Chang Cheh film feels like Lau Kar-Leung was a co-auteur. The typical focus on brotherhood and violence, while here, is muted for a greater concern on martial-arts technique, pedagogy and history, the sort of thing that would be front and center in LKL's filmography. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Killer Meteor Posted February 10, 2014 Member Share Posted February 10, 2014 Yeah, the third film of the Shaolin Cycle, after Men from the Monastery and before Five Shaolin Masters. I'll actually go to bat for Shaolin Martial Arts as one of my favorites of the series. I came to it late because of its utter lack of reputation, but the movie passed well beyond my expectations. This, and not Five Shaolin Masters, is where Shapes begin. You not only have the choreography, but the entire structure is the classic "Kung Fu Cycle" of lose/train/fight/win that became pretty much gospel in the genre. Gordon Liu, Johnny Wang and Leung Kar-Yen all make their proper debuts here, and even veteran Simon Yuen here seems to develop the curmudgeonly kung-fu master schtick that would become his bread and butter over the next few years. The focus on training and student-teacher dynamics are in place a whole two years before Challenge of the Masters, which is suppose to be the film that really inspired all the imitators. Speaking of which, this more than any other Chang Cheh film feels like Lau Kar-Leung was a co-auteur. The typical focus on brotherhood and violence, while here, is muted for a greater concern on martial-arts technique, pedagogy and history, the sort of thing that would be front and center in LKL's filmography. It took me a while to get into Shaolin Martial Arts, its virtual lack of music seemed to make it really drag. I definetly like it a lot more now. Agreed that it mostly feels like a Lau film - heck SPOILER the heroes make it to the end, and walk off into the sunset with their girlfriends/sisters/cousins/whatever. One thing that is rather unusual is the casting of the sifus. The Eagle Claw master is Chiang Nan, , so I had him pegged first time to be an Manchu infiltrator (it's the teeth, sorry!). And the Wing Chun master is played by the bulky, usually villianous, usually Japanese Feng Yi. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Eastern Evil Posted February 10, 2014 Member Share Posted February 10, 2014 It took me a while to get into Shaolin Martial Arts, its virtual lack of music seemed to make it really drag. I definetly like it a lot more now. I tell you what, it has (imo) one of the coolest pieces of music in any movie at the 46;45 mark & goes for a full 3 minutes. It plays during the training sequence where Tong Yen Tsan is catching fish with his hands & Gordon Liu is doing rolls & his training. Anyone know if it is a classical tune of some note? It sounds like it is from a King Arthur movie or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Eastern Evil Posted February 10, 2014 Member Share Posted February 10, 2014 I tell you what, it has (imo) one of the coolest pieces of music in any movie at the 46;45 mark & goes for a full 3 minutes. It plays during the training sequence where Tong Yen Tsan is catching fish with his hands & Gordon Liu is doing rolls & his training. Anyone know if it is a classical tune of some note? It sounds like it is from a King Arthur movie or something. Here is the tune, I just threw this together real quick - I really love this piece of music! ?v=uktIMY1EJec&list=UUNAL9Sh8sF5-3T7xjZJlxlA&feature=c4-overview Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Killer Meteor Posted February 10, 2014 Member Share Posted February 10, 2014 Here is the tune, I just threw this together real quick - I really love this piece of music! ?v=uktIMY1EJec&list=UUNAL9Sh8sF5-3T7xjZJlxlA&feature=c4-overview That is good music! Afraid I don't recognise it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Secret Executioner Posted February 10, 2014 Member Share Posted February 10, 2014 Boy, I really should avoid reading some threads. The discussion on Shaolin Martial Arts is very interesting and makes a great read, but now I wanna see that film. The music mentionned by Eastern Evil, while I have no clue what it is or where it comes from, is indeed very nice. And I think it gives the scene a certain dramatic aspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Chinatown Kid Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 I'm snowed in tonight in NC so think ill use the time to re watch the Shaolin Cycle trilogy. It's been a while since I saw them so I want to reevaluate how they rate. Think I'll start with Men from the Monastery first to see if it's as bad as people have stated on here recently lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Tex Killer Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 Boy, I really should avoid reading some threads. The discussion on Shaolin Martial Arts is very interesting and makes a great read, but now I wanna see that film. You should go for it. In my book it`s more entertaining movie than disciples. Disciples is good "only" but drama of one mans rise and fall never got me that interested so I would not consider it as one of best where fu sheng appeared. Like mentioned before storyline has similarities to big boss which is superior movie, thanks to ferocity and martial skill of bruce. Ending is neat, I like concept here CKC stays in background most of time. Man was underused in shaw brothers really, to see him doing lot fighting one should go for his other studios movies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Cold Bishop Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 Will I get in trouble if I say that Big Boss is a terrible movie, albeit one with a truly charismatic star? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Tex Killer Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 Will I get in trouble if I say that Big Boss is a terrible movie, albeit one with a truly charismatic star? Same applies to his other movies. Bad supporting actors, cheap looking sets&costumes, mediocre scripts at most.. Bruce makes them worth watching, replace him with less talented man and those would be trashcan stuff... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Cold Bishop Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 Yet if you replaced Fu Sheng and Chi Kuan Chun with, say, Tsung Hua and Wong Chung, Disciples of Shaolin would still probably be a damn good film. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Tex Killer Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 Yet if you replaced Fu Sheng and Chi Kuan Chun with, say, Tsung Hua and Wong Chung, Disciples of Shaolin would still probably be a damn good film. Yes it would be..but fu sheng and chi kuan chun are easier to replace without quality of movie dropping big time. Bruce is not. Put fu sheng into big boss, film would likely be epic fail. It needs bruces screen energy and his lighting fast punches&kicks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Cold Bishop Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 But that's not an argument in favor of The Big Boss. Star power can only take a film so far... you have to have the other things. DoS has them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Tex Killer Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 Production values and cast are better in DoS, plotwise they are about equal. But Star Power makes big boss more enjoyable film - for me at least.It`s a rare example of movie where one man can make difference. For example in hollywood (action cinema) it would not be possible for one actor to save film... Not even he was able to save films every time, tho..I found personally way of the dragon pretty boring minus few good fights. (But for directing debut it maybe was ok, he had talent in that area too. Some scenes were pretty clever.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Cold Bishop Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 For all its sloppiness, Way of the Dragon at least has its own unique verve, which makes it stand apart from the dull melodrama of his two Lo Wei films. And I don't think they're at all equal plotwise. Or the better word should be "dramatically". DoS has a level of nuance, sensitivity and secondary meaning that's completely lacking in the Lo Wei film. It's easily one of the best written films of Ni Kuang's career. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Killer Meteor Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 For all its sloppiness, Way of the Dragon at least has its own unique verve, which makes it stand apart from the dull melodrama of his two Lo Wei films. And I don't think they're at all equal plotwise. Or the better word should be "dramatically". DoS has a level of nuance, sensitivity and secondary meaning that's completely lacking in the Lo Wei film. It's easily one of the best written films of Ni Kuang's career. I'm told Ni Kuang worked on the Bruce films, but isn't credited. The Big Boss has a surprisingly emotional storyline, so it's not just Bruce holding it up alone. Ditto Fist - good story on the whole. But boy, once Lo Wei and Bruce parted, Lo Wei turned out some incredibly lethargic films. All the energy of his Shaws and early GHs - just gone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Cold Bishop Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 I find most of the melodrama in Big Boss to be pretty obvious stuff. "Violence, eh? Can't live with it, can't live without it. At least not if you want asses in the seats". I also don't buy Bruce as the guileless innocent that the story requires once he becomes foreman. There's an interesting tension in Fist of Fury, in between its patriotism/xenophobia, and Chen Zhen's more self-destructive impulses... but that lethargy is already present and bogs down the chunks of the film where Bruce isn't Jap-bashing. I've softened on my antipathy towards Lo Wei thanks to those earlier films. Brothers Five is one of the great unsung classics of its era, just pure fun back to back (and a surprising amount of hand-to-hand technique for a 1970 film). Will at Silver Emulsion has actually been reviewing Jackie Chan's early films and has had me intrigued to try some of them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member massa_yoda Posted February 13, 2014 Member Share Posted February 13, 2014 Will at Silver Emulsion has actually been reviewing Jackie Chan's early films and has had me intrigued to try some of them. Wow, this is a great site. He has a ton of Shaw Brothers reviews as well. Who is this? Someone on the forum? Amazing I haven't stumbled on these reviews before...I usually look for stuff like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted February 14, 2014 Member Share Posted February 14, 2014 Will I get in trouble if I say that Big Boss is a terrible movie, albeit one with a truly charismatic star? Not trouble but I disagree with you that it's a terrible film. I believe the Big Boss, was a very influential film going against the odds for its time. Countless of other films have tried to copy that structure of film and story ever since. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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