Favorite Shaw Brothers director?

[Guest Stuntman Jules]

So anyways, I'm wondering, who is everyone's favorite director to work at the Shaw Brothers?

Personally, my favorite is really getting to be Sun Chung. Human Lanterns is an all time favorite of mine, as are Avenging Eagle and The Drug Connection (which I actually prefer to Coffy, Sun's direction is far more energetic than Jack Hill's). I've really yet to see a Sun Chung film I haven't liked, though I didn't go nuts over his debut The Devil's Mirror or The Bloody Escape, but the former had superb cinematography and the latter had some great drama scenes.

As for everybody else, I think Chor Yuen's movies were superb only some of the time. I love Intimate Confessions, The Magic Blade, his Haunted Tales segment, Clans of Intrigue, etc, but many of his other Gu Long films just get too @#%$ weird for their own good, no matter how beautifully photographed they are.

Kuei Chih Hung and Ho Meng Hua were both mad geniuses in their own right, I especially dig Black Magic II.

And then there's Mou Tun Fei (T.F. Mous). I almost feel guilty about this, as I know he's an incredibly heavy handed director who loves to disguise his sickeningly exploitative work as important political statements, but I love Lost Souls, as well as his non-Shaw films Men Behind the Sun and Black Sun, which are incredible in how sickening and depressing they are, but they aren't entertaining like Lost Souls and his Haunted Tales segment are.

I'm really starting to think that Chang Cheh wasn't that great of a director. I have a few favorites from him, namely the @#%$ violent as hell The Boxer From Shantung, Vengeance (which is surprisingly well made for one of his films) and The Blood Brothers. That said, most of his films aren't all that well made. They tend to have weak framing and composition, whereas directors like Sun Chung and Chor Yuen concentrated heavily on the visual aspect of their films. Also, Chang overused the zoom lens to an almost comical point. His movies are all watchable, but when I want an SB flick that's perfectly balanced between art and entertainment, I pop in Human Lanterns or Avenging Eagle.

[Guest BKarza]

Sun Chung

Chang Cheh(he's the most influential to/for me)

LKL

Lu Chun Ku

[Guest Mantis FIST]

This is too easy for me, hands down it is Lau Kar Leung! I have always liked his movies the best. He seems to understand the true spirit of Martial Arts! I have always enjoyed his philosophy on MA. I wish he would right a book!

Was coffey a remake of The Drug Connection? Never really seen other. I do have the coffey ost. Some really funky music on there!

[Guest Stuntman Jules]

THE DRUG CONNECTION was a remake of COFFY, actually.

[littlefuzzy]

So far, I have only seen:

Chia-Liang Liu - The 36th Chamber of Shaolin

Chin-Ku Lu - The Master

Cheh Chang - The One-Armed Swordsman, The Brave Archer, House of Traps (watching now.)

As far as Chia-Liang Liu, I plan to get these soon: My Young Auntie, Heroes of the East, Challenge of the Masters, and Martial Club.

Cheh Chang also has a bunch coming: The Deadly Duo, Flag of Iron, Heroes Two, Life Gamble, Ten Tigers of Kwang Tung, The Heroic Ones, Two Champions of Shaolin, and a handful of the Image titles.

It's weird how so many of the Tokyo Shock titles are Cheh Chang...

[Monk Sante]

For me it would have to be Chang Cheh, the bloodiest director the Shaw Bros had to offer! XD

[Iron Boat]

CC, his filmography is wide and diverse, also LKL choreographed many of his films and I prefer LKL's choreo much better than his directing. Sun Chung's style imo, is similar to Cheh, complimentary...

[Stanley]

Those who like kung fu will select Lau Kar leung;

Bloody males only fighting will like Chang Cheh;

If King Hu(only one action movie for Shaw) can be considered, I will vote for him.

Honestly to be fair, my personal vote should be Li Han Hsiang(too bad he don't have action films) but my favourite director is Chor Yuen, very versatile, and his movies are mostly star-studded, colourful and fast-pased.

[jhayden]

Stuntman Jules is right on point with his post.

Ditto my feelings towards Chang Cheh as of late.

I think one of the things that the Celestial/ILV/Shaw remastering/releases have done is to put all these directors under a magnifying glass once and for all.

Everyone's work is here to see (for the most part anyway) and it's all done on equal footing (in other words, all the titles look uniformly lush).

To that end, I'm seeing a lot of these films in a new light and with a much broader, more complete perspective.

Chang Cheh's stuff, while I still love the guy and always will, actually seems to play better as crappy bootlegs! Don't ask!

He became more and more derivative as time went on. I hold the Venoms stuff close to my heart for sentimental reasons but I can clearly see why he really lost his popularity back home by that point.

I think, if the man was not as prolific as he was, then perhaps we wouldn't all be holding him in such constantly high regard?

Something to think about.

Ditto on Sun Chung.

I need to check out some of his older, modern day stuff (Drug Connection, Fangs of the Cobra, Lady Exterminator, etc.), but I've been sold on him for a long time.

Perfect sense of style this guy has (for me anyway). Love his use of slo-mo better than Chang Cheh's too! His composition was such that he became really one of the only Shaw directors I can think of who made those normally claustrophobic sets actually feel larger than the real outdoors!

Loved Human Lanterns.

Really wish he would have done another straight ahead kung fu movie after that one as you could tell by those few fight scenes (especially the ones with Lo Mang) that he and Tong Kai were at their symbiotic peak.

Just some of the most gorgeously photographed fight scenes ever. Sun Chung really does elevate the "kung fu on film" to a level of art here.

My Rebellious Son while fun, you could tell was a disjointed production.

And it suffers as a result.

Avenging Eagle? Classic. And one of the most absorbing stories in the Shaw cannon I might add.

I won't go into his other films (special mention to Kung Fu Instructor and The Master Strikes Back) but the fact that he made so fewer than someone like Chang Cheh in fact helps him out here. Fewer films, more jewels. More precious.

[DeathShrike]

I agree that I think Chang Cheh is overrated. Other than Boxer From Shantung, all of the movies he made that I like are Venom films, and it is certainly not because of his direction. My favorite director from Shaw Bros. other than Lau Kar Leung, is Lu Chin Ku, with Lady Asssassin, Bastard Swordsman, Return of Bastard Swordsman, Holy Flame of the Martial World, and Secret Service of the Imperial Court.

[jhayden]

Funny. I was going to add another post mentioning Lu Chin Ku as a favorite and underrated at that. Good call.

Not the stylist or artisan that Sun Chung was, the man knew how to make fun, entertaining movies.

Hopefully someone will get around to releasing Lover's Blades one day.

(Not to mention To Kill a Mastermind speaking of Sun Chung!)

[wuxiawuxia]

I like Chu Yuan (Chor Yuen) the most, but only for his "real" wuxia classics (Killer Clans, Clan of Intrigue, Sentimental Swordsman, Death Duel, Magic Blade, Intimate Confession..), he sort of lost it by the 80s... so anything older when he was the top of his game, and his sentimental drama (Lover's Destiny, Forbidden Past, etc).

Chang Cheh was great pre venoms, then he just blew it when he transitioned from Fu Sheng to the venoms era. I know the 5 Venoms was highly revered in the West but I wasn't impressed at all when I saw it, it's the same recycled themes, you kind of know who's the bad guy, who's the good guy, if you've watched other venoms movies in the past. So no surprised at all. IMHO, Chang Cheh's best was when Wang Yu and Ti Lung/David Chiang were still his favorites.

Sun Chung was great but not as prolific and just so all you know, Avenging Eagle's story was really not his idea, it's an adaptation from a wuxia book, with some changes of course, so kudos to him and whoever wrote the script to fit the film format.

Lau Kar Leung is great for kungfu, but his stories are always weak to me. Same thing over and over again and a lot of stupid comedies. When I watch his films I just fast forward to the fight scenes. And Yes, I am probably one of the odd ones who can't understand why Dirty Ho, 8th Diagram Pole Fighter, and and the 36th Chamber of Shaolin have huge fanbase. They're entertaining, but never amazed me. Just like that last fight in "Martial Club," that was a timeless classic scene but the film itself was weak.

As far non Kungfu/non Wuxia, I'd definitely pick Li Han-Hsiang, he is one of the best Chinese directors the world has ever seen. Maybe it's hard for us to dig Huang Mei now, but everything in a film such as "Love Etherne" was perfect, down to the last word of the song to the perfect camera angle and set. His "Empress Dowager" and "Last Tempest" remain two very classic, most epic Qing Court drama from that period.

[teako170]

[peringaten]

I enjoy pretty much all of them... except Lu Chi, who was a really shit director, Shaw's ropiest by far, but the recurrent boobies, & craziness of stuff like Stud & The Nympo give even that guy a pass with me. Lu Chi; rubbish director, but still... Shaw films generally interest me regardless. Hsu Hsia is a legend, but that man was far better AD'ing for other directors than in the seat himself; still enjoy his films though. The rest of them I hold all pretty equally in high regard, including some less prolific. Couldn't remotely state a favourite; interests & film preoccupations change day to day, Shaws catered for many moods. A few I consider great lesser mentioned or not at all in this thread - Kuei Chih Hung, Lo Mar, Tong Gaai, Hua Shan, Cheng Kang, Ho Meng Hua, not to mention a few of the nigh-on one-off guys who directed some of my favourite stand-alones, Tsiu Siu Ming, Yuan Hao Chuen, Lung Yi Sheng, etc. You expect me to start picking favourites - tough job!

Shaw overall style is a champ; love the way all these different guys uniquely exploited, furthered & adapted it. Credit to the crews!

[The Dragon]

Chang Cheh.

The man was not over-rated. He had innovative ideas which helped change and head the film industry in a new direction, leaving a legacy which challenged contemporaries to raise their consciences, when it came to movie making. Looking back on his body of work some of it may seem less than others, however, for their time, his contributions cannot be overlooked.

[Poelie]

While it is most certainly true that Chang Cheh made significant contributions he also manages to really piss me off sometimes.

For example: I recently rewatched Boxer Rebellion. Here he has a decent budget, a great historical setting, great actors but he manages to lose me early in the movie when at a demonstration an extra gets shot. This guy, probably thinking it was his only chance to shine, takes forever to die from the gunshot. It is a completely over the top moment which in my opinion ruins the serious tone of the movie. And more so at the end when our villain (Wang Yu?) needs to be killed. This also goes on forever, in slow-motion and again completely over the top. These kind of scenes are in the case of this movie really not necessary: it's not that kind of movie, and I blame Chang Cheh.

[peringaten]

Chang Cheh was really just remaking that old Boundary Gate opera over & over & over & over & over & over again, regardless anything else he was dealing with production-wise; like a man obsessed. Good stuff.

[Iron Boat]

I like the fact that Cheh's heroes take forever to die, thats what makes him Cheng Cheh. I consider many of CC's films classic, other directors have many good films but only a few I'd call classics.

[GwaiLoMoFo]

My favorite director by FAR is Lau Kar Leung. Honorable mention to Sun Chung and Lu Chun Ku.

[butcher wing]

Cheng Cheh

Lau Kar Leung

King Hu

Im all about Kung Fu, Kung Fu, Kung Fu there are some other good ones (Derek Yee) but for me its shapes galore, and training, and kung fu everyday all day.

[kungfusamurai]

It's a tough call. I love Pops films, even though he has a couple that I don't particularly like, but Chang Cheh was THE MAN. He directed so many great films, and if it wasn't for him, guys like LKL and John Woo might not have developed into accomplished filmmakers. Chang Cheh was able to create films that could appeal to fans of movies in general, not just kung fu film fans. And he was fairly consistent throughout his whole career, except for a few duds at the tail end post-Shaw Bros.

One guy who gets overlooked, but whose films I enjoy is Lo Mar. This guy seems to have come up with a great formula for creating entertaining action films, and he had his own group of guys similar to what LKL and CC were doing. His output in the kung fu genre seemed to have started and ended very abruptly. I can't find any write-up anywhere why he suddenly stopped. Although he's credited with Five Superfighters, Monkey Kung Fu, and Boxer From The Temple, I've read one review that he was also the director for Fighting Fool, but his name was removed when the film was released and a pseudonym was used instead. I wonder if FF was his last film, and he had a falling out with Shaw during the filming, and hence the change in directing credit, and his disappearance from the film industry? Or did he just become sick or injured and/or die?

KFS

[peringaten]

It's a tough call. I love Pops films, even though he has a couple that I don't particularly like, but Chang Cheh was THE MAN. He directed so many great films, and if it wasn't for him, guys like LKL and John Woo might not have developed into accomplished filmmakers. Chang Cheh was able to create films that could appeal to fans of movies in general, not just kung fu film fans. And he was fairly consistent throughout his whole career, except for a few duds at the tail end post-Shaw Bros.

One guy who gets overlooked, but whose films I enjoy is Lo Mar. This guy seems to have come up with a great formula for creating entertaining action films, and he had his own group of guys similar to what LKL and CC were doing. His output in the kung fu genre seemed to have started and ended very abruptly. I can't find any write-up anywhere why he suddenly stopped. Although he's credited with Five Superfighters, Monkey Kung Fu, and Boxer From The Temple, I've read one review that he was also the director for Fighting Fool, but his name was removed when the film was released and a pseudonym was used instead. I wonder if FF was his last film, and he had a falling out with Shaw during the filming, and hence the change in directing credit, and his disappearance from the film industry? Or did he just become sick or injured and/or die?

KFS

Yuan Hao Chuen, the guy who directed What Price Honesty did Fighting Fool. Lo Mar did work on another late-era Shaws film, called something like The Spearmen starring Austin Wai; enough of it was shot for them to promote the production in mags of the day & the like, but the film was apparently scrapped when iirc I think Austin severly injured his back whilst filming. Don't know if that played a part in the lack of further output from Lo Mar - who knows...

[kungfusamurai]

Yuan Hao Chuen, the guy who directed What Price Honesty did Fighting Fool. Lo Mar did work on another late-era Shaws film, called something like The Spearmen starring Austin Wai; enough of it was shot for them to promote the production in mags of the day & the like, but the film was apparently scrapped when iirc I think Austin severly injured his back whilst filming. Don't know if that played a part in the lack of further output from Lo Mar - who knows...

Thanks for clearing up the directing credit on Fighting Fool. I just realized that I got that information from IMDB, and should have figured since it wasn't written anywhere else, it was incorrect.

I seem to recall a thread in the old KFC about Lo Mar's unfinished project, and I think someone had posted those promo images. Hmmm...if someone got hurt during Lo Mar's film, and that guy had huge pull in the industry, it might explain the sudden end to his martial arts movie making (and it seems like his entire film making) career. I think he could have churned out some great flicks during the 80s if he eventually switched over to modern day actioners.

KFS

[The Dragon]

I like the fact that Cheh's heroes take forever to die, thats what makes him Cheng Cheh. I consider many of CC's films classic, other directors have many good films but only a few I'd call classics.

I kind of agree with Iron Boat. Taking a little longer to die is supposed to reflect the strength of a patriot, not so much to be corny or hammy. The more a hero displays invincibility, the more uplifting it is for Chinese Face. Really no different than when our old Westerns depicted shootouts with six-shooters that never got reloaded, or when a guy dodged gun fire by ducking behind a rock/tree, or object to shield himself, after being fired upon.

[Alexandra]

I like Chu Yuan (Chor Yuen) the most, but only for his "real" wuxia classics

Chang Cheh was great pre venoms, then he just blew it when he transitioned from Fu Sheng to the venoms era.

Chang Cheh's best was when Wang Yu and Ti Lung/David Chiang were still his favorites.

Sun Chung was great but not as prolific and just so all you know, Avenging Eagle's story was really not his idea, it's an adaptation from a wuxia book, with some changes of course, so kudos to him and whoever wrote the script to fit the film format.

Lau Kar Leung is great for kungfu, but his stories are always weak to me. Same thing over and over again and a lot of stupid comedies.

As far non Kungfu/non Wuxia, I'd definitely pick Li Han-Hsiang, he is one of the best Chinese directors the world has ever seen.

I agree with you with your appreciations about Chor Yuen in his classics, agree with you in Chang Cheh totally, directing Ti Lung and David Chiang. And directing Alexander Fu Sheng in my appreciation, was not good. It's necessary a kind of "mystical chemistry" between the actor and the director, I can't found this one between Alexander and Chang Cheh despite the fact that they were together in more than 20 films. I don't understand why Alexander remains so long with him. Yes I know, contracts and so.

I love Sun Chung, he deeply emotional style, is very creative, love his slow motion scenes (some directors abuse of this effect and result annoying or unnecessary) the angles of the camera, and the prosecution of the sequence - planes in slender way, etc.

Don't agree with you with Lau Kar Leung, I guess he was not a super director, just good one. As a great martial arts instructor he catched the moments in fight scenes in a different way that the other ones. If he liked the comedian style, it was his choice. If the comedies seems to you stupid, well is your taste, ok!

I don't know the last director you mentioned. Another title? Maybe I can see a movie and appreciate his values.

Alexandra