Guest chen lung Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 Quite a few things... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Running Man Posted December 26, 2006 Share Posted December 26, 2006 Is there anything on the dvd making it worth the purchase if i have the IVL boxset? Read my review. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest FarEastPirate Posted December 27, 2006 Share Posted December 27, 2006 The Dragon Dynasty has nice extras but the Video quality on the film is awful, the old megastar DVD's are better quality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest morgoth Posted December 27, 2006 Share Posted December 27, 2006 Tough call if the movie is worth it for the extras. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest killer meteor Posted December 27, 2006 Share Posted December 27, 2006 It looks to me like besides the pinking, they fiddled with the contrast, resulting in blooming whites and so on. The HKL Fist Of Fury and Wheels On Meals have this problem too. I never had much faith in White - he cropped Snake In The Eagle's Shadow and Drunken Master to increase their marketbility to teenagers and claimed that most of the nation's DVD players couldn't handle 2.35:1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gfanikf Posted December 28, 2006 Share Posted December 28, 2006 Well warts and all I'm going to pick it up today. I have a dvd-r of the IVL and I'm more interested in the extras since the IVL didn't really have any. Still I wish they would sort these issues out for future releases. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest limubai2000 Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 They should use the Buena Vista guys for the mastering, those guys are supposedly the best in Hollywood if not the world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chen lung Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 ...wouldn't be possible as they can only use what FS provides (their own approved restoration) so they wouldn't be able to have access to film prints. I'm sure when it comes to titles maybe owned by Mei Ah or whatever could do restoration by themselves. True, Buena Vista has great video restorations (probably the only good thing about them at the time) and I would have personally preferred to have seen it done too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Running Man Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 ...wouldn't be possible as they can only use what FS provides (their own approved restoration) That isn't true. DD messed up the existing Police Story print FS provided. That's why the IVL release looks better than DD's. And it isn't the source print that really counts. It's who is doing what to the source print that is the determining factor. True, Buena Vista has great video restorations (probably the only good thing about them at the time) Only good thing about them? Surely you don't forget that it was Harvey Weinstein that forced alterations upon these films. Not Buena Vista. And honestly, any US studio is better than Brian White and his team. Look at the hacked up releases of Hitman, High Risk, and New Legend of Shaolin. Although disturbed by Columbia, it was some Z Grade studio (Silver Nitrate), that is connected with underground rap, that produced those versions and the colors on those prints are gorgeous. Their Contract Killer video kills HKLs crappy release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chen lung Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 That isn't true. How is it not? DD messed up the existing Police Story print FS provided. That's why the IVL release looks better than DD's. We know that. Surely you don't forget that it was Harvey Weinstein that forced alterations upon these films. Not Buena Vista. We're not talking about the alterations or who personally wanted it. And honestly, any US studio is better than Brian White and his team. Sure... Look at the hacked up releases of Hitman, High Risk, and New Legend of Shaolin. Although disturbed by Columbia, it was some Z Grade studio (Silver Nitrate), that is connected with underground rap, that produced those versions and the colors on those prints are gorgeous. The 'New Legend of Shaolin' version is OK but rather disappointing. Check out my comparison where even the lowly Universe has an advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Running Man Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 How is it not? How isn't it? Read the reply. We know that. Then you must of forgot because if you knew that you wouldn't have written your comment in the first place. We're not talking about the alterations or who personally wanted it. Read what I quoted from you and you'll know why I wrote that comment. Sure... Are you being sarcastic here? I can't tell. The 'New Legend of Shaolin' version is OK but rather disappointing. Check out my comparison where even the lowly Universe has an advantage. Cause it's brighter? Baahh...the anamorphic image still kills all other versions on the market right now. Compare HKL's Hitman to Contract Killer. HKL looks like crap. Even Mei Ah's remastered release is better than the HKL DVD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chen lung Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 How isn't it? Read the reply. Now I understand. From what limubai2000 said, I kinda thought he meant working from scratch (directly from a print) which is why I said about DD only being able to use whatever FS gives them. Media Asia seemed to be the opposite in which case, they actually supplied prints and the distributors themselves performed the restoration to it. With this already-prepared source, there isn't much you can do other than artificially fix colours up to a limited extent if you were attemping to match New Line's quality (if you're working with a digital source) which has obviously gone disasterously here (also with the boosted contrasts). Read what I quoted from you and you'll know why I wrote that comment. There was nothing wrong with the video's quality and the only alterations Buena Vista did were the audio and obviously re-editing (Harvey re-edited, Brian changed the colours - different issues and the former doesn't apply here). Are you being sarcastic here? I can't tell. Yeah I was. Cause it's brighter? Baahh...the anamorphic image still kills all other versions on the market right now. The sides were chopped off and blowed up (check out how fatter Wong Jing looks:b ). The capture with Xiao Miu and the other kid - colours look awful (blend-in too easily). Compare HKL's Hitman to Contract Killer. HKL looks like crap. Even Mei Ah's remastered release is better than the HKL DVD. I believe you, but I can't as I only have the HKL DVD. Can you provide screencaptures anyway (would be interesting to see)? Thanks:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Running Man Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 With this already-prepared source, there isn't much you can do other than artificially fix colours up to a limited extent Is that how White works? Not from prints but just from digital sources? In any case, it doesn't matter. Even if he wasn't working from an actual print, there is no excuse to make the print look that bad. Only a fool would take the image and make it worse. And this is how White has been doing it from day one. Making prints look worse and ruining the images than and only cause there was nothing really to compare the prints at the time to, did people hail HKL. That and the fact that the Dimension prints were heavily altered so people unfortunately did not give the images on those prints an honest comparison. There was nothing wrong with the video's quality and the only alterations Buena Vista did were the audio and obviously re-editing (Harvey re-edited, Brian changed the colours - different issues and the former doesn't apply here). You said that the only thing about Buena Vista at the time was their video restoration. Are you not implying the altered versions of the films? Yeah I was. Too bad for the sarcasm then man...cause it's true. Brian White sucks at video restoration. The sides were chopped off and blowed up (check out how fatter Wong Jing looks ). The capture with Xiao Miu and the other kid - colours look awful (blend-in too easily). Yeah, there does seem to be a problem with the image being stretched out a lil. But it's nothing compared to the heavy amount it occurred to on every other HKL release. And the colors don't look awful my man. That Legend of the Red Dragon print looks like a film that was made yesterday compared to the Universe DVD which makes it look like a movie that was shot in 1982 and found in someone's garage. I believe you, but I can't as I only have the HKL DVD. Can you provide screencaptures anyway (would be interesting to see)? That wouldn't be a bad idea. I'll get around to it when I can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Markgway Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 All of those NLOFS caps look poor in different ways. The ENGLISH/FRENCH maybe the sharpest, but the colours are way off. This film still needs a proper release. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest killer meteor Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 I always found it ironic that HKL, considering the remix junkies they would become, released genuine 5.1 films like The Blacksheep Affair and Hitman, in mono. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest chen lung Posted December 31, 2006 Share Posted December 31, 2006 Is that how White works? Not from prints but just from digital sources? It can depend... For the Seasonal Films and stuff from Mei Ah, that seemed to be restoration work on HKL's behalf because for the majority; only film prints were available to them. Colour correction at HKL was often very poor - Examples include 'Big Boss' and 'Fist of Fury'. But at Fortune Star, DD can only work with more-or-less what's directly given to them (for legal reasons) except what we see here with regards to the pinkification - I'm not entirely familiar with the situation however. Sadly film prints are not an option (unlike what New Line had when Media Asia were still around holding them). Pinkification was definately not nessesery regardless and it does look horrible (along with other adjustments such as the aforementioned contrast that killer meteor brought up and edge enhancement). FS complete one restoration in HD digitally and then it's passed onto DD e.t.c for easy mastering AFAIK (strangely between Fox/IVL e.t.c and HKL, they sometimes differ in image information. Why - I don't know). Apparantly, the non-remastered ones are taken from beta sources (why not 35mm prints?). Media Asia (who didn't restore anything) supplied prints for Dimension, HKL e.t.c to restore themselves and the results varied. Dimension often (or always) had the upper hand when it came to the video section with a nice balance of everything (sharpness e.t.c) - just like the TV broadcastings when 'Dragons Forever' came on when it may have looked better than the FS job (would be nice to see a comparison if someone recorded the broadcastings onto a digital source). HK Video were very good but seemed 'pale' in their presentation (their advantage was minimal cropping and distortion without much sharpness lost but colours were still not very prominent - very good however). HKL unfortunately 'bled' their presentation with the softness and everything going into each other and nothing standing out. Examples include: cropping and blowing up to compensate, loss of sharpness lost, noise removal (which is vital to help maintain detail and sharpness - 'lazy' restoration often becomes responsible for this) and awkward colour correction. I'm sure you'll probably know all that but correct me if I'm wrong at any bits;) . Are you not implying the altered versions of the films? I was referring to their butchered films which had great video restorations, but everything else was lame. Shame DD didn't have access to film prints as opposed to what FS offered. I'd like to see a IVL/Spectrum vs DD comparison:) . And thanks Mark;) . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Linn1 Posted January 1, 2007 Member Share Posted January 1, 2007 film print, beta, etc. depends on the film and how much work the company wants to do. HKL would have had the option in most cases to get a film print and remaster it themselves if they wanted. It is cheaper and perhaps better, but more confining, to let FS do the masters. But that also means that you can't change them much once they are delivered. Color and sharpness can usually be changed with a little explaining to the company. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Running Man Posted January 1, 2007 Share Posted January 1, 2007 Colour correction at HKL was often very poor - Examples include 'Big Boss' and 'Fist of Fury'. Pretty much every film honestly. But at Fortune Star, DD can only work with more-or-less what's directly given to them (for legal reasons) except what we see here with regards to the pinkification - I'm not entirely familiar with the situation however. Sadly film prints are not an option (unlike what New Line had when Media Asia were still around holding them). Well first of all, New Line was actually working from the old US print of the film, not a new Media Asia print. That gives even more embarrassment to DD's crap disaster. And the "pinkification" is the absolute least of the DD's Police Story's print problems. The colors are completely washed out and at the same time the contrast is forced giving that weird over sharpness look. And that's the main point here. No matter what the source was, it is obvious that they have total freedom to do what they want with it...and they are making it worse. Brian White does not come from a video restoration background and neither does his team. I wouldn't be surprised if the dude's background was from marketing and sales. A smarter man would hire a professional company to take care of the video. He is not a professional in that field and should know better. He doesn't know what he is doing plain and simple. I remember coming across something online where White said that Crime Story was meant to look like a documentary and thus that's why he made the HKL print look all grainy and washed out. Uhhhh....no....it isn't supposed to look like that at ALL and he ended up making the worse print of that film on the market. The real problem here though is since he has that Weinstein connection. Like I mentioned, at least he had people that knew what they were doing when he was back at Miramax/Dimension. But now that he has given control over to White, now many of these films will never look as they should look ever. It doesn't help that many of these reviewers are totally ignorant of this and give good marks to the Police Story discs. I have come across some online, not to mention Mark Pollard's review, that do so and their ignorance is making the situation worse. If White is not made aware of this issue and does something about it, I will not hesitate to make a petition and spread the word. Seriously, at least when White was only at HKL there were other options. But now with Weinstein they are going to be spreading to other markets with this garbage. PS Scott and Mark If you think the Universe disc of New Legend of Shaolin is superior to the Legend of the Red Dragon print...you're both cuckoo. :b Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Markgway Posted January 1, 2007 Share Posted January 1, 2007 Re. New Legend/Red Dragon. I'm just going by those caps on the link. I never said that the Universe was better... where?? Just that the colours are off on the Paramount F/E print (if that's identicial to the Col/Tri, I don't know, because I haven't seen it?) We still need a quality uncut version don't we? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest The Running Man Posted January 1, 2007 Share Posted January 1, 2007 Dude...I put a " :b " I'm not being serious about it so don't worry. And yeah of course, no matter which looks better, the very fact remains that a quality version of the uncut film is lacking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest killer meteor Posted January 1, 2007 Share Posted January 1, 2007 I recall a few early DVDs from various compaines had this "pinkifcation" problem. My Ghostbusters II DVD from 1999 is an example. Why they did that I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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