Why Jackie Chan puts quantity over quality?

[Rodolphe Dux]

2 minutes ago, Asmo said:

Look at his upbringing, it probably partially explains his need/want for fame. Isn't necessarily the case with the other Opera School graduates, though.

Fair point, but among all the Opera School graduates, he's probably the most greedy and unmoved. That's not a problem though, he's a good craftsman and an hard worker, he deserves what he got but I don't feel an artistic touch in his work, that's just a job like any other. With Sammo Hung (for example), there are real artistic and visual  work and point of view, Chan just do movies like I do some code.

[Ramji]

 

27 minutes ago, Rodolphe Dux said:

Fair point, but among all the Opera School graduates, he's probably the most greedy and unmoved. That's not a problem though, he's a good craftsman and an hard worker, he deserves what he got but I don't feel an artistic touch in his work, that's just a job like any other. With Sammo Hung (for example), there are real artistic and visual  work and point of view, Chan just do movies like I do some code.

I’m sorry but that’s nonsense. Project A 1 & 2? Miracles? Overflowing with imagination and artistry....

Sure, things are different now but he was at his artistic peak in the 80’s. You can’t take that away from him. 

Edited September 21, 2018 by Ramji
Typo

[Rodolphe Dux]

34 minutes ago, Ramji said:

I’m sorry 

I’m sorry but that’s nonsense. Project A 1 & 2? Miracles? Overflowing with imagination and artistry....

Sure, things are different now but he was at his artistic peak in the 80’s. You can’t take that away from him. 

Project A is a good movie (I personally don't like it but it is), Miracles too and Armour of God either, they are fun well done movies, but I think Hung movies like Encounters of the Spooky Kind are way more interesting regarding script, music, editing and cinematography.

But it's a matter of taste anyway. Again, the early 80's Chan movies are mostly good, my point was they are just Chan movies, mainly focused on Chan's stunts like a trademark. I wasn't trying to blame Chan's movies, I like them but I think that those movies were (are) good exploitation movies, but for Hung's I think they're more than exploitation (and exploitation is not a bad word for me). That's all.

That being said, after the 80's I don't get Chan's work, I watched Bleeding steel lately, I didn't like it like many of his modern movies. But two years ago I was astonished by the script of the despised "My beloved bodyguard".

Edited September 21, 2018 by Rodolphe Dux

[DragonClaws]

 

Jackie Chan is no saint, but show me an actor/performer who is perfect?. He's also not the only member of the Three Dragon's to get some bad press etc.

 

Sammo Hung caught cheating with 21 year old actress(2012)

Link- https://www.jaynestars.com/news/63-year-old-sammo-hung-caught-cheating-with-21-year-old-student/

 

It could be media/tabloid pulp?, but then some of the stories about Chan will be the same.

Edited November 4, 2018 by DragonClaws

[Rodolphe Dux]

4 hours ago, DragonClaws said:

 

Jackie Chan is no saint, but show me an actor/performer who is perfect?. He's also not the only member of the Three Dragon's to get some bad press etc.

 

Sammo Hung caught heating with 21 year old actress(2012)

Link- https://www.jaynestars.com/news/63-year-old-sammo-hung-caught-cheating-with-21-year-old-student/

 

It could be media/tabloid pulp?, but then some of the stories about Chan will be the same.

Fair point. But basically, let's not appreciate artists like them on the private stuff, it's misleading, especially when they are famous as the three dragons are, the medias love to spoil the stars. The most important thing for me audience is how good the movies are. The rest is not our business, and in the end their fictional characters are not who they are in real life, I hope so. The three dragons gave us legendary movies, that's what matters.

 

But to give my opinion to the question asked at first, yes I think Jackie Chan puts quantity over quality, because he's a good craftsman, that's what he does, no matter what.

Edited September 21, 2018 by Rodolphe Dux

[Omni Dragon]

On 8/15/2018 at 9:37 PM, Drunken Monk said:

You also have to remember he's 64 years old. If he can do as little physicality as possible and still get paid a shit-ton of money, I imagine he's going to do just that. Perhaps his dedication to the craft as waned as he gets long in the tooth. 

As he's older I feel he could perhaps take more behind the camera work, or perhaps play more mature characters with younger actors in the young action hero role.   

8 hours ago, Rodolphe Dux said:

Chan seems to be in need (in love?) of fame, glory and money. I'm not sure, by the way he acts during interviews that he likes making movies or even cinema itself, that's just his way to get fame and money. The more I (re)watch movies with the three dragons, the more I think he's the weakest and most phoney of the three. Sammo Hung is an awesome director with an outstanding filmography, Biao is a brilliant actor and martial artist. Chan is a decent clown acrobat, a hard worker but not an humble nor an upstanding person. That being said, there are masterpieces in his filmography, mostly pre-police story and due to fantastic directors and producers, after that he was bedazzled by hollywood. 

Fame seems to have got to his head.

 

[DragonClaws]

On 9/21/2018 at 9:31 PM, Silver and Gold Dragon said:

Fame seems to have got to his head.

 

I dont think any human, no matter how good/nice they are, cant be left untouched by the level of fame Jackie Chan has got.

 

He's also done a lot of good with his mony and influence.

 

 

[JackieRome]

Interesting these negative opinions alternated with the artistic aspects of his career. he was obsessed with his art, his dedication and his desire to establish himself in the early years of his career. Still today, I can't do without his most famous films on a cyclical basis. Jackie, whether you like it or not, is the reference point for most people who love Hong Kong cinema. As far as the consideration of the man (it's not for us to judge, but he's a public person and his behaviour could be an example to me for many people), I'm not the kind of fan whose eyes shine on everything he does and says his idol, on the contrary, I'm very critical of the aspect of his personality. In all honesty I've never been convinced by his flaunted charity, unflattering opinions about his person etc, I think he's a megalomaniac with a lot of power and surely in his life he's taken advantage of it more than once. His being accompanied by people who "casually" develop ambiguous personalities and unexemplary actions: I think of Bey Logan (Weinstain's colleague, caught also denounced by an actress) I think of Brett Rattner (another person linked to sex scandals), much of this makes me think. Participate in the remake of karate kid I saw him as one of the lowest points of his career. a film to please the son of Will Smitt by putting him next to the most famous actor of martial arts. Or titles like Forbidden Kingdom, the union of two talents (they were already grown up) united in a film of dubious quality for children; or Operation Babystitter... better to shut up and say nothing else. either way, that makes it clear that he never cared about quality; that was perhaps a consideration of the 30-year-old Chan in his best years; the older Chan only makes movies for money, not to get bored and for a whole other set of conveniences. And then, during all these films he still makes today, he manages to make 1-2 decent titles... ...well that's almost fortunate given the professional approach he has. As it makes me think of the low quality films he has been producing for many years now (with very few exceptions and I think of: Little Big Soldier, Police Story 2013, The Foreigner... ) seasoned with shoddy Cgi, bad stories, exotic locations to make economic deals, and casually... always with beautiful women who clearly can't act. That Chan likes women isn't a mystery and these ambiguous ties combined with his externalities (book, etc.) can only give more and more truth to certain stories. this doesn't affect at all the pioneering and brilliant Chan in the best years of his career.  The Medallion, which came out when Jackie was still old enough to make as many good movies (as New Police Story proved years later), I always identified it, unlike Thunderbolt, as an example of emblematic crap in his career, and I'll never understand how there were so many talents involved - I'm thinking of Bey Logan, who, beyond his hypothetical sketches, knows martial arts cinema well and then writes a similar screenplay; Sammo directed, the whole team was the most creative of his stuntmen- and yet a film came out that gave me an endless sadness that I still bear the signs of today. I hope you can understand something of my rant... be patient.

Edited April 4, 2020 by JackieRome

[Graeme Of Death]

JC is probably my favourite kung fu actor, the one that got me into kung fu films, and whose films I can watch over and over again but let's face it he's a bit of a dick. He pretty much admits it himself in his latest autobiography.

The thing that annoys me the most is the does his own stunts thing. He probably does more of his own stunts that any other action actor in history but he's never done all of them. Obviously not including vehicle stunts there's plenty of his standard stuff where you can see it's not him. 

Always thought the like of Mars and Chin Kar Lok must have got paid an absolute fortune by him to keep up the Jackie does it all schtick.

Anyway that aside, still the greatest Asian action star of all time.

JackieRome I wouldn't be having PTSD over The Medallion as much as it is a load of shite. 

I would say in general he's been done since Rush Hour. He's just like every other artist, be it author, musician, actor, the creative spark and passion for their art eventually disappears. 

[DiP]

I guess his desire to leave for Hollywood took over once he succeeded. He was in his absolute peak with Drunken Master 2 but still was in great shape for another 10 years to put out more quality movies if it weren't for that. But it's understandable, people change in time and he probably came to a point where he told himself that he couldn't keep making these physically demanding movies all the time as he was aging. Again, it's reasonable. However, that doesn't substitute most of the lousy movies he's been making since then. As of now, a few have stood out (Shinjuku Incident, Little Big Soldier, The Foreigner), and some were decent at best (the Rush Hour and Shanghai movies) but overall the amount of roles he took tarnished his legacy quite a bit. Fame and money does that to many actors.

Edited February 5, 2021 by DiP

[JackieRome]

Shinjuku Incident

It's the kind of movie Jackie had to keep insisting on, and he never went near it again. While New Police Story could have been his swan song in action cinema, this was supposed to be the sensational entrance to the drama. Shinjuku is a great film and it's a pleasure to watch it again; it's been many years since I saw it and it always works. Tension, violence, great rhythm. Despite some naivety (Danile Wu is as good as ever but when his character changes psychologically and presents himself with a J-rock look, it's very funny) this film was a great test for our Jackie. It's a shame he hasn't touched certain heights of quality anymore.

[Cognoscente]

As long as he doesn't do too many movies like Yuen Siu-Tien did then it's okay.

[DarthKato]

I believe a lot of his films are made just for the money, and it shows(Like The Medallion and The Tuxedo). But then again, a lot of movies that he seems passionate about(Like 1911) aren't that great either. So I don't really know what his problem is. But I can honestly say that I haven't really enjoyed any of his films since the late 00s(Probably around Rush Hour 3), save for a few(Railroad Tigers was pretty good). 

[Cognoscente]

Maybe he needs the money for charity.

[starschwar]

After the initial explosion of the first two Rush Hours and Shanghai Noon, I had high hopes for his Hollywood career.  Then came Tuxedo, Medallion, Around The World - it felt like he threw away all the good will he'd built up to that point.  In just a few short years he went from being a megastar to playing second fiddle to Will Smith's son.  I've never worked up the courage to actually try and watch The Spy Next Door.  I wish he'd been more considerate in deciding which projects to sign on to, which scripts had substance to them.  I'm not saying his later Hollywood output is entirely devoid of merit but - there was this great expectation for the hits to keep on rolling. 

[Cognoscente]

I secretly hoped that Jackie would have made the move from buddy movies to solo ventures but it never happened.

For what it's worth, The Spy Next Door is better than The Tuxedo and The Medallion. It has the novelty of seeing Jackie fight the actor who became the new MacGyver, which is fitting since Jackie's trademark style of fighting is essentially MacGyver-esque (one of the writers of the old MacGyver even co-wrote Armour of God).

[starschwar]

He's solo in The Foreigner.  Brosnan's his costar, but they're far from buddies.  I don't think they have more than a few scenes together.  That movie was okay, but I expected a lot more from the people involved, both in front of and behind the camera.

[Cognoscente]

I mean in the noughties during the heyday of his popularity, and when he could still pull off a decent fight scene. The Foreigner would probably have been better had it been done in place of New Police Story.

[starschwar]

Fair.

[Cognoscente]

Nosebleed could have been a worthwhile solo project for Chan. After 9/11, I'm surprised that it didn't get made because they could have always found somewhere else to do the Die Hard-esque plot.

[Omni Dragon]

16 hours ago, Cognoscente said:

I mean in the noughties during the heyday of his popularity, and when he could still pull off a decent fight scene. The Foreigner would probably have been better had it been done in place of New Police Story.

I certainly would not have minded something with an acting style like that of The Foreigner and the action style like that of New Police Story.