Member saltysam Posted August 25, 2019 Member Share Posted August 25, 2019 Enter The Dragon is the most iconic martial arts movie ever made. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DragonClaws Posted August 25, 2019 Member Share Posted August 25, 2019 16 hours ago, ShawAngela said: I don't know if Enter the dragon is overrated, and I don't even know if it has been commented in France when it was released, but I know that I love it for a lot of reasons : the music, Angela and Bruce and John Saxon too (and even Shih Kien. Maybe you have not being as exposed to the hype surrounding it. It was one of those movies I was well aware of, long before I seeked out watching it. 16 hours ago, Killer Meteor said: My problem with it is retrospective - for 20 odd years it became the template for too many poor US/HK crossovers that were content to mimic Enter forumla or credits but not even attempt to better it. The likes of Black Belt Jones and The Big Brawl are fun, but are unambitious, and rely on Robert Clouse being used as an audience enticement when his strengths lay elsewhere and not in kung fu. It got worse when he started writing the damn things! Imagine Bruce or Jackie making movies with the likes of Don Siegel! Agreed, you make some very good points here @Killer Meteor. Robert Clouse was the first American Martial Arts movie director, he could jumped started his career off the back of ETD. He did of course get a lot more work in the genre of the back of it. Sadly none of those film's had the same kind of impact. Imagine if Black Belt Jone or The Big Brawl had managed to make a different kind of impact, but on the same scale as ETD's success. He could have been rememered as the man who intoruded Western audiences to the unique talents and film style of Jackie Chan. 11 hours ago, TheKungFuRobber said: All those movies are much better than Enter the Dragon, because they actually have uniqueness. Enter the Dragon is the most overhyped movie ever made. It is so boring, it actually makes me want to watch Ninja The Protector. No matter how good it turned out, ETD would have to eventually date like it has done. Fan's who saw this first time round, didn't have the same exposure to Martial Art's cinema. Enjoyed ETD when I first saw it, but it wasn't this big ground breaking experience. I'd already grown up with Martial Arts via Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and whatever Van Damme or Chuck Norris movie I'd watched. For my generation that came in the form of fims like Saving Private Ryan(1997). A movie which set a whole new bar in the War/Action genre. Or 1998's The Matrix, which had a big effect on action cinema. That said, I loved how Bruce Lee carried most of the film on his own back. No heavy use of fancy optical effects etc. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member TheKungFuRobber Posted August 25, 2019 Member Share Posted August 25, 2019 10 hours ago, Killer Meteor said: THE ASSOCIATION is...diabolical. It doesn't even have an ending! I agree on GH putting decent new music into their films*, which dates back to FIST OF FURY with its specialy composed Joseph Koo songs. It's sad that by the late 70s, Shaws, THE big studio, was like, "just stick some random De Wolfe cues on the damn thing and shove it out!" * Alongside recycled cues. I used to think Koo was a genius until I realised half of his scores were still Ennio Morricone! It's production was flawed. To quote Paul Bramhall's review from CityOnFire: "The Association was made between these movies, and was originally intended to be a two part crime epic, teaming him up with his fellow countrymen Byong Yu and Hwang In-shik, both masters in the Korean art of Hapkido, as well as being shot in Korea. Sadly, things went wrong along the way. The story, which focuses on a welfare agency for young women actually being a cover-up for a prostitution and abortion (not necessarily in that order) ring, features a fairly heavy dose of exploitation, which comes in the form of liberal helpings of female nudity. Byong Yu, who as it would turn out would make his first and last screen appearance in The Association, despite being the main character, wasn’t entirely comfortable with the more sleazy elements of the production, and ultimately would buy out what was planned to be the first part, preventing it from being released. So The Association is in fact the second part to what was originally a much bigger tale, patched together so that it runs as coherently as possible." I recognize the films flaws and I wasn't too keen on the borderline softcore lesbian sleaze in the movie, but I found the film to be an interesting production and would have liked to have seen Grandmaster Byong Yu in more movies. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted August 25, 2019 Member Share Posted August 25, 2019 Romeo must die. My friend swore it was the greatest film of all time. I thought it was ok, jet li and Aaliyah were the best parts for me. Enter the Dragon, really? I never knew that, it's not my favorite movie ever but def iconic as all heck. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Gaijin84 Posted August 25, 2019 Member Share Posted August 25, 2019 Click bait topic title Most overrated ever? No way... you also have to take when it was made into account. It was so far ahead of other kung fu movies put out at that time it’s not even fair. Same is true about all of Bruce Lee’s films. He was a visionary far ahead of his time. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Omni Dragon Posted August 26, 2019 Member Share Posted August 26, 2019 I think it ETD is proportionally rated in terms of it's culture and historical impact to the US and most of the western world. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Omni Dragon Posted August 26, 2019 Member Share Posted August 26, 2019 3 hours ago, OpiumKungFuCracker said: Romeo must die. My friend swore it was the greatest film of all time. I thought it was ok, jet li and Aaliyah were the best parts for me. I suppose if person X thinks movie Y is the best movie ever but person Z doesn't agree, then person Z thinks person X has overrated movie Y. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member TheKungFuRobber Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) This is class. Love this. Restored my respect for Tarantino which i lost for him for his refusal to condemn high profile celebrities such as his old pal Harvey Weinstein and Kevin Spacey abusing their power to sexually assualt others during the the MeToo case, at least not until long after the case became well known. He still has the balls to do this in spite of the unrelenting toxicity of Bruce Lee fans. Let's not forget that Bruce Lee was good friends with the likes of Roman Polanski (pedophile who raped 13 year old and got away with it) and Sharon Tate (Polanski's wife who was murdered by the Manson family in 69), and Bruce himself wasn't really known for his loyalty to his family or for treating women with respect. No hate to Bruce Lee but he was only human. He wasn't superhuman at all. I wouldn't pit him in an IRL fight against Hwang Jang Lee. Respect for the dead of course. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5701205/Bruce-Lee-womanizer-got-circumcised-American.html Edited August 27, 2019 by TheKungFuRobber Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Killer Meteor Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 I really hate the Daily Mail. And to be fair to Bruce, Polanski wasn't in 1969 known as a sex offender, and it's hardly his fault Tate got murdered. I think it's more funny how the Estate likes to pretend Betty Ting Pei never existed. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member ShawAngela Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) 13 hours ago, TheKungFuRobber said: No hate to Bruce Lee but he was only human. He wasn't superhuman at all 13 hours ago, TheKungFuRobber said: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5701205/Bruce-Lee-womanizer-got-circumcised-American.html I agree that actors and not superhuman and that they must have their good and bad sides as anyone among us, but their private life should stay their private life. Maybe I'm the only one here to have this point of view, but in my opinion, cinema, actors/actresses and stars are here to help us to deconnect from the real life and make us dream, so, I don't see the point to reveal someone' s private life to million of people. First, does this author Mister Polly have any proof of what he says, except what the women he mentions said ? Are there any dates, witnesses, pictures ? If Linda Lee is now 73, all these people are maybe of the same age, do they have their whole memory intact ? In addition to that, witnesses like Steve Mc Queen are already gone, so, who can confirm ? It already happened in the past that some celebrities told stories to the media, just in order to get more celebrity among the fans (at least, it happened here in my country), so, it might be the same for Bruce Lee and all who pretend to know what happened...I myself can claim to have been in love with one of my favourite actors, make a photo montage showing us together but if there is nobody to confirm that we have been seen together somewhere on some day at some hour, who can say that it's true or not ? Frankly, once again, I don't see what is the use to tell all these stories about Bruce Lee, because it might heavily disappoint his fans (at least, I am disappointed to have read all of this in this article), and it might make the non fans despise him and lead them to say things like " look at this great star, who was so proud of himself and his work and was a so disgusting guy !" and I think of Linda Lee and Shannon Lee who have to live with all of these biographies that are more or less kind to their husband and father. As I said, private life is private life and if someone wants to write something on Bruce Lee or any other celebrity, it should be only to tell people about his skills as an actor and martial artist and let his family away of scandals. I'm not the biggest fan of Bruce Lee (I discovered him very late in comparison to my other favourite actors), but for me, he will stay the fabulous actor I appreciated in Enter the dragon and Fist of fury and that's all. Edited August 27, 2019 by ShawAngela 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 On 8/25/2019 at 8:41 PM, Silver and Gold Dragon said: I suppose if person X thinks movie Y is the best movie ever but person Z doesn't agree, then person Z thinks person X has overrated movie Y. What do you think of Romeo Must Die? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 13 hours ago, TheKungFuRobber said: This is class. Love this. Restored my respect for Tarantino which i lost for him for his refusal to condemn high profile celebrities such as his old pal Harvey Weinstein and Kevin Spacey abusing their power to sexually assualt others during the the MeToo case, at least not until long after the case became well known. He still has the balls to do this in spite of the unrelenting toxicity of Bruce Lee fans. Let's not forget that Bruce Lee was good friends with the likes of Roman Polanski (pedophile who raped 13 year old and got away with it) and Sharon Tate (Polanski's wife who was murdered by the Manson family in 69), and Bruce himself wasn't really known for his loyalty to his family or for treating women with respect. No hate to Bruce Lee but he was only human. He wasn't superhuman at all. I wouldn't pit him in an IRL fight against Hwang Jang Lee. Respect for the dead of course. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5701205/Bruce-Lee-womanizer-got-circumcised-American.html He cheated on Linda or he abuse women i don't understand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member ShawAngela Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 2 minutes ago, OpiumKungFuCracker said: What do you think of Romeo Must Die? I don't know what Silve and Golden dragon thinks about it and sorry if I interfere in the discussion, but I loved this movie !! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) That scene was like mike moh's first scene ever in a movie. There was no way like moh was going to get the upper hand on brad pitt who has been in the business for decades. That's not a bruce Lee depiction, more like bruce li? Mike Moh was fantastic by the way. Dude needs to do more roles. Edited August 27, 2019 by OpiumKungFuCracker 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member saltysam Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 Respect for Tarantino? The guy who forced Uma Thurman into driving a stunt car in Kill Bill and her almost getting seriously injured? I like a lot of his films but the guy himself is an absolute douchebag as far as i'm concerned. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, saltysam said: Respect for Tarantino? The guy who forced Uma Thurman into driving a stunt car in Kill Bill and her almost getting seriously injured? I like a lot of his films but the guy himself is an absolute douchebag as far as i'm concerned. I agree and the dude has a weird obsession with feet. I don't want to see that shit in his movies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Omni Dragon Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 1 hour ago, OpiumKungFuCracker said: What do you think of Romeo Must Die? I've never actually seen it. Probably not as good as movie Y though.😁 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member TheFlyingPanda Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) Never Saw ETD as overrated, Personally Fist of Fury is My favorite and Way of The Dragon after that.. But I can see the whole western influence and how magazines, media and marketing can push that. The fact is that it was a breakthrough for it's time and paved the way for future Martial arts films in the US and for asian lead rolls in a Hollywood film. Yes! I wish a Hong Kong stunt team and Choreographer like Sammo were running the show, but that's Hollywood for ya (especially at that time, filled with bigotry, stereotyping and racism) they killed of Jim Kelly, wtf was that!? Anyways.. Bruce Lee broke through that barrier, but lets not forget he was a "human" with more then you may expect against him.. he was turned down, ignored, neglected as a martial artist and pushed away more than you might think. The thing is that now that he is an icon... modern people want to devalue him, tear down the wall that is his mythology because we live in this new pussified culture. The New book is subjective and so is allot of articles and stories from people who "so called" met him. They want to show you his faults, mistakes and all that jazz.. Yea, no shit, he was practically a kid when he passed away, never having the chance to fully blossom Like other stars did (for example Jackie Chan). I don't personally care what Bruce did in privet, I care about his art, and the mark he left on the world same way I care about what Theodore Roosevelt Did or Charlie Chaplin achieved... I'm not for anyone talking shit about him, or you might as well talk shit about Alexander Fu Sheng and Lau Kar-leung or Chuck Norris and Mohamed Ali for that matter. As for Tarantino's film... just another fictional bruceploitation, plain and simple. Enter the Dragon was a big move on the chess board, no matter what anyone says... that's not gonna change, but doesn't mean Enter The Dragon is the cream of the crop neither... shit, we martial artist/ movie fans know it. If Kung Fu Magazine or Hollywood or Black Belt or whatever wants to Hype it as the best, well then go ahead, at my home theater it's gonna be something else. Edited August 27, 2019 by TheFlyingPanda misspelling 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member ShawAngela Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) 18 minutes ago, TheFlyingPanda said: (especially at that time, filled with bigotry, stereotyping and racism) they killed of Jim Kelly, wtf was that!? Anyways.. Bruce Lee broke through that barrier, but lets not forget he was a "human" with more then you may expect against him.. he was turned down, ignored, neglected as a martial artist and pushed away more than you might think. I totally agree with that. They killed Jim Kelly because of his color, the same way they killed David Chiang in 7 golden vampires because it was a Hammer movie before being a Shaws' movie, or the same way they turned out to be ridiculous the Chinese actors in This time I'll make you rich, because once again, it wasn't a pure Chinese movie and so on... I read somewhere that Bruce Lee was about to get the role of Caine in the series Kung Fu, but that he was put away from it and they chose David Carradine, because Bruce was " too Chinese " ! What a shame, and how he must have felt when he was told about that ! I totally understand that he wanted to show what he was worth in the States and maybe it's the reason that pushed him to be so good in all his works. Once again, I don't have a very large knowledge about Bruce Lee, but I'm beginning to be more interested in his works and I even recently started a small collection of magazines and postcards of his movies... I also have his earlier movies (at least some of them), when he was a kid and a teenager, but I still haven't had time to watch them, as well as the Green Hornet series... And I plan to buy Longstreet and if it's wasn't to pricey, I would also get the series Here comes the bride... Edited August 27, 2019 by ShawAngela 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member TheKungFuRobber Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 I would quote the fat kid from No Retreat No Surrender, but I think maybe I would be being too much of an asshole. Honestly though, I don't really think Bruce Lee was evil or anything crazy like that. I was just posting a criticism because the title of the post to me gave this topic page that purpose. The man died at only 32, just a young man with children. I do agree that we live in a very politically correct age where it has become "woke" to produce crap shitting on beloved people of the past for their flaws. Bruce Lee was a good man. I grew up idolizing him, like he was some kind of God among men. His role in Enter the Dragon was important against typecasting of Orientals in Hollywood resulting from the Yellow Peril. Hollywood itself is evil. At the same time, I found the Tarantino scene amusing, gotta hand it to Tarantino that he had the guts to piss off a whole bunch of Bruce Lee fans. Not exactly the first time Bruce Lee has been disrespected in death, directors are just trying to line their pockets with money of fans to capitalize on the whole Bruceploitation bandwagon. The unrelenting outrage created by the whole scene in the media will probably just encourage more people to buy tickets. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member ShawAngela Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 12 minutes ago, TheKungFuRobber said: Honestly though, I don't really think Bruce Lee was evil or anything crazy 12 minutes ago, TheKungFuRobber said: Bruce Lee was a good man. I grew up idolizing him, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DragonClaws Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 2 hours ago, ShawAngela said: I read somewhere that Bruce Lee was about to get the role of Caine in the series Kung Fu, but that he was put away from it and they chose David Carradine, because Bruce was " too Chinese " ! What a shame, and how he must have felt when he was told about that ! I totally understand that he wanted to show what he was worth in the States and maybe it's the reason that pushed him to be so good in all his works. It's also said that the producer's thought he was too intense for the role of Caine, which needed to be more passive and relaxed. Suggesting it just wasn't a matter of race, though it's pretty clear thsi effected the work he got in Hollywood. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member TheFlyingPanda Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 Kung Fu Was said to be Cancelled because Carradine had sustained to many injuries, but there are rumors about him being drunk on set and that was a problem.. I never looked in to it, perhaps a member here knows more about that. David Caradine didn't know martial arts beginning his role as Cain and that is clearly evident now watching the series. I cringe at it the same way when watching Saxon in ETD. I really, really, really tried to watch all of Kung Fu without falling asleep watching how slow and stiff David was, lol. I made it till the end though. Would Bruce have been better? Fawk-Yeah, no matter how hyper he was! Shoot Chuck Norris would have been better, We would have Walker 21 years earlier... Jeez, someone with Martial arts training That's 70's Hollywood folks! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Coliseum1972 Posted August 27, 2019 Member Share Posted August 27, 2019 (edited) Lots of stars have cheated , even Norris did at one time.....Chan and Sammo , too Rick Rude never cheated on his wife although Im sure there were temptations on the road...... IMO , Enter is grandfather of todays MA films Edited August 27, 2019 by Coliseum1972 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member OpiumKungFuCracker Posted August 28, 2019 Member Share Posted August 28, 2019 19 hours ago, Silver and Gold Dragon said: I've never actually seen it. Probably not as good as movie Y though.😁 It has a great cast Jet Li/Aaliyah/DMX,Isaih Washington before the scandal/Russell Wong,Delroy Lindo the OG, Anthony Anderson before blackish,Derek Lowe,Francoise Yip,Grace Park 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.