Member DragonClaws Posted February 13, 2017 Member Share Posted February 13, 2017 We used to have a thread for this film, before the forums went down. Thought I'd re-start the thread, with the movies latest official full length trialer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member laagi Posted February 13, 2017 Member Share Posted February 13, 2017 I have to say with all the recent material surfacing on this I went from skeptical to pretty excited. Only thing I would say I dislike up to this point is the possible PG-13 rating. I just don't get it why they would "downgrade" adult material. Look at the recent assassin's creed movie. Why make a game material rated M into some bloodless crap!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Takuma Posted February 14, 2017 Member Share Posted February 14, 2017 I think the new trailer is remarkably bland and boring (I guess it has to be in order for the mass audiences to like it) compared to the earlier one that was pretty stylish, and I'm starting to get a little worried about how digital a lot of stuff in it looks. I'm still looking forward to it, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Karlos Posted March 22, 2017 Moderator Share Posted March 22, 2017 You can watch the first 4 mins 30 secs via this link - https://twitter.com/ParamountUK/status/844504557166170112/video/1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member laagi Posted March 23, 2017 Member Share Posted March 23, 2017 22 hours ago, Karlos said: You can watch the first 4 mins 30 secs via this link - https://twitter.com/ParamountUK/status/844504557166170112/video/1 Thank you for the link Karlos. Looks pretty good to me, think I'll try to catch this in cinema. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DragonClaws Posted March 27, 2017 Author Member Share Posted March 27, 2017 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member FieryReign Posted March 27, 2017 Member Share Posted March 27, 2017 Looks dumb to me. Whitewashing this day and age. Her costume/suit looks ridiculous. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Karlos Posted March 28, 2017 Moderator Share Posted March 28, 2017 Scored free tickets to this on Thursday. Not getting my hopes up. Will report back. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Karlos Posted March 30, 2017 Moderator Share Posted March 30, 2017 Well, I really dug it. very well made, shot clearly, looks amazing (most of the time) and Beat Takeshi has THE most awesome late 70s anime hair ever. The PG-13-ness does take something away from it, though. Loses some oomph. Give it a try. EDIT: Now I've slept on it, I can see why there's been controversy over so-called "whitewashing". I'm very much in two minds as to whether the film was wise to do...what it does (no spoilers). I'm not sure, maybe I'll need to see it again. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Takuma Posted April 1, 2017 Member Share Posted April 1, 2017 On 31.3.2017 at 1:50 AM, Karlos said: EDIT: Now I've slept on it, I can see why there's been controversy over so-called "whitewashing". I'm very much in two minds as to whether the film was wise to do...what it does (no spoilers). I'm not sure, maybe I'll need to see it again. I haven't seen it yet (opens here next week) but my understanding is that the "whitewashing" is mainly an issue for people of Asian ethnicity living abroad, especially those in the US, who feel they are under presented and underappreciated in cinema and media. That's an understandable point. However, at the same time I'd like to point out that most Japanese audiences don't mind one bit. Many of them realize the financial realities ($110 million Hollywood production with unknown Japanese stars who probably can't speak English? Financial suicide!), some like Mamoru Oshii don't think a cyborg should be necessarily be portrayed by a Japanese actress, and some are just happy to see a big Hollywood star in the role. Personally I can't think of any Japanese actress who they could've hired for the role. Rinko Kikuchi? Japanese audiences hate her! Some idol? Thank god they didn't. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Karlos Posted April 1, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 1, 2017 Very interesting post, Takuma. Thanks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DrNgor Posted April 1, 2017 Member Share Posted April 1, 2017 8 hours ago, Takuma said: Rinko Kikuchi? Japanese audiences hate her! Is there a good reason for that? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member FieryReign Posted April 1, 2017 Member Share Posted April 1, 2017 8 hours ago, Takuma said: I haven't seen it yet (opens here next week) but my understanding is that the "whitewashing" is mainly an issue for people of Asian ethnicity living abroad, especially those in the US, who feel they are under presented and underappreciated in cinema and media. That's an understandable point. However, at the same time I'd like to point out that most Japanese audiences don't mind one bit. Many of them realize the financial realities ($110 million Hollywood production with unknown Japanese stars who probably can't speak English? Financial suicide!), some like Mamoru Oshii don't think a cyborg should be necessarily be portrayed by a Japanese actress, and some are just happy to see a big Hollywood star in the role. Personally I can't think of any Japanese actress who they could've hired for the role. Rinko Kikuchi? Japanese audiences hate her! Some idol? Thank god they didn't. You just said Japanese audiences don't care so if Rinko played the part, what would it matter? How about trying to make a star out of an up and coming Japanese actress? I can think of quite a few actresses of Asian descent they could've used. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Takuma Posted April 1, 2017 Member Share Posted April 1, 2017 (edited) 23 minutes ago, DrNgor said: Is there a good reason for that? No. It seems a lot of Japanese people dislike her because she didn't follow the usual idol / TV celebrity path, and got famous abroad before anyone knew about her in Japan. Her public image is also kinda "western" as opposed to the typical Japanese kawaisa. 18 minutes ago, FieryReign said: You just said Japanese audiences don't care so if Rinko played the part, what would it matter? I said the Japanese audiences don't mind if a white Hollywood actress plays the role. 18 minutes ago, FieryReign said: How about trying to make a star out of an up and coming Japanese actress? I can think of quite a few actresses of Asian descent they could've used. Try telling that to a Hollywood producer. Edited April 1, 2017 by Takuma 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member laagi Posted April 2, 2017 Member Share Posted April 2, 2017 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Takuma Posted April 3, 2017 Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 (edited) The fuzz reminds me about the Katy Perry performance a few years ago. Many people in Western countries considered it racist. The Japanese, when asked about it, couldn't figure out what the fuzz was about. They just thought it was cool. Not related to the above, but I just came across this article from last year: https://www.theguardian.com/film/2016/jul/01/japan-hollywood-influence-ghost-in-the-shell-magnificent-seven Edited April 3, 2017 by Takuma 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Writ Posted April 3, 2017 Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 It's a good movie. Very competently directed even if the script was at times laughably bad. Visuals are an absolute treat, and the action is fun enough. My main issue with the film is that it doesn't pack that visceral punch that the original 1995 anime film does and it only makes shallow nods to the ideas presented in that one. But hey, for a mainstream Hollywood movie, you could do much worse and to be fair, pretty much every sci-fi film since the original have dealt with the same themes - this would seem derivative to the majority of audiences regardless. Think a Christopher Nolan film but one that actually looks pretty and you'll have an idea what this film is like. Whitewashing for me is never a problem since it never takes away from the quality of a movie. Would this have been a great film with a Japanese actress in the lead? No, it'd be the same film. On 4/2/2017 at 2:04 AM, FieryReign said: You just said Japanese audiences don't care so if Rinko played the part, what would it matter? How about trying to make a star out of an up and coming Japanese actress? I can think of quite a few actresses of Asian descent they could've used. Maybe you can think of a few, but what about the millions that the film will alienate because of it? Not a single Asian actress right now can guarantee box office success in Hollywood right now. When you're spending over $100 million, you're at least hoping to get a return on that investment regardless of backlash. On 3/31/2017 at 5:50 AM, Karlos said: EDIT: Now I've slept on it, I can see why there's been controversy over so-called "whitewashing". I'm very much in two minds as to whether the film was wise to do...what it does (no spoilers). I'm not sure, maybe I'll need to see it again. I agree. I can't make up my mind whether or not the film was wise to do that because you could really make an argument for both sides. I guess for some it might add insult to injury, but for others it could possibly be somewhat redeeming? I dunno because I didn't really care about the whitewashing in the first place. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator Karlos Posted April 3, 2017 Moderator Share Posted April 3, 2017 The more I think about it, the more I think any controversy could've been side-stepped easily. That said, I liked it - yes, it's a diluted, shallower version of the original, but it's nowhere near the car crash some are hysterically making it out to be - not by a long shot. But don't worry, guys, it's being trounced at the box office by a cartoon about a baby, so all is well again. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member FieryReign Posted April 3, 2017 Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 (edited) 1 hour ago, Writ said: It's a good movie. Very competently directed even if the script was at times laughably bad. Visuals are an absolute treat, and the action is fun enough. My main issue with the film is that it doesn't pack that visceral punch that the original 1995 anime film does and it only makes shallow nods to the ideas presented in that one. But hey, for a mainstream Hollywood movie, you could do much worse and to be fair, pretty much every sci-fi film since the original have dealt with the same themes - this would seem derivative to the majority of audiences regardless. Think a Christopher Nolan film but one that actually looks pretty and you'll have an idea what this film is like. Whitewashing for me is never a problem since it never takes away from the quality of a movie. Would this have been a great film with a Japanese actress in the lead? No, it'd be the same film. Maybe you can think of a few, but what about the millions that the film will alienate because of it? Not a single Asian actress right now can guarantee box office success in Hollywood right now. When you're spending over $100 million, you're at least hoping to get a return on that investment regardless of backlash. I agree. I can't make up my mind whether or not the film was wise to do that because you could really make an argument for both sides. I guess for some it might add insult to injury, but for others it could possibly be somewhat redeeming? I dunno because I didn't really care about the whitewashing in the first place. Alienate millions? Because of an asian actress? What year is this? Stop. The anime wasn't made for western audiences in the first place. The millions who know what it is already watched the films and tv series. Then maybe they shouldn't have made it then? How about an original script with an original concept? Nobody asked for this. How about remastering and rereleasing the original film? Why does everything need to be bastardized(westernized) with white people? So you're saying Hollywood is racist then? Nothing has changed since Bruce? Please stop accepting it. Edited April 3, 2017 by FieryReign Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Writ Posted April 3, 2017 Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 41 minutes ago, FieryReign said: Alienate millions? Because of an asian actress? What year is this? Stop. The anime wasn't made for western audiences in the first place. The millions who know what it is already watched the films and tv series. Then maybe they shouldn't have made it then? How about an original script with an original concept? Nobody asked for this. How about remastering and rereleasing the original film? Why does everything need to be bastardized(westernized) with white people? So you're saying Hollywood is racist then? Nothing has changed since Bruce? Please stop accepting it. Yes. Yes. 2017. How does that make any of what I said false? You or anyone else being angry doesn't change the fact that what I'm saying is true. The millions being alienated are are the ones who have no idea what the original anime is and would more likely watch it because of a white actress in the starring role. It's the unfortunate reality of the world right now that white stars make more money than Asian ones. It didn't need to be made, but it was and it isn't nearly as bad as many people thought it would be or are making it out to be. And if you have any idea about the source material, you'd know that the Major was never said to have a Japanese body either so there's even an in-universe explanation for said "whitewashing" even if the idea itself is unethical. And while the original wasn't made for Western audiences, what is wrong with translating foreign stories for the Western world if done right? Heck, we're on a forum where people love watching Hong Kong movies dubbed in English! I'm not saying this film did everything right, but it's a start. Did you ever think you'd see Beat Takeshi in a strong role in an English language movie? Well we got it with this one! Baby steps man. Though let's be honest. Because of it's popularity, I'm sure many people were asking for live-action Ghost in the Shell. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Takuma Posted April 3, 2017 Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 I was about to say the exact same thing. I do appreciate FieryReign's moral stand, but I do not think it is realistic at all. The film cost about $110 million to make. That means it needs to make about $220 million to break even. To do that, the film must appeal to people who have never heard of GitS before. Attracting fans alone won't be even close to enough. Now, let's see how much the original animated films made theatrically in the US: - Ghost in the Shell: $500 000 (about $800 000 in modern currency) - Innocence: $1 million (about $1.3 million in modern currency) For the fun of it, we could also include Shin Godzilla in the comparison - Shin Godzilla: $2 million in the US, $78 million worldwide. I would have loved to see a Japanese actress in the role as well, but like Writ said, there are no Japanese actresses with such global appeal that their movie can be expected to gross a minimum of $220 million. I'm happy they made the film, though. If anything, it may spark more interest in Japanese culture, and maybe some day we will have Japanese stars Hollywood producers feel confident can appeal to audiences around the world. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Drunken Monk Posted April 3, 2017 Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 Despite it's obvious racism, the film is actually very good. I thoroughly enjoyed it. It's beautifully shot, well acted and intriguing enough to have kept me engaged the whole time. From the trailers, I was expecting an overly convoluted plot, but it was actually pretty straight forward. Yes, a Japanese actress should have played the lead. Especially when... **SPOILER** Spoiler ...the film reveals that she was Japanese and that only her shell is a white woman. **SPOILER** But, beyond that, it's a damn good sci-fi action film. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member Drunken Monk Posted April 3, 2017 Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 Fun fact: Richard Norton was Scarlett Johansson's fight coach for the film. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Member DragonClaws Posted April 3, 2017 Author Member Share Posted April 3, 2017 5 hours ago, Drunken Monk said: Fun fact: Richard Norton was Scarlett Johansson's fight coach for the film. Posted Nortons FaceBook comments about working with Johansson, in the Richard Norton thread last week. Not sure if he had any involvement in the choreography?. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator KUNG FU BOB Posted April 4, 2017 Administrator Share Posted April 4, 2017 11 hours ago, Drunken Monk said: **SPOILER** Reveal hidden contents ...the film reveals that she was Japanese and that only her shell is a white woman. **SPOILER** But, beyond that, it's a damn good sci-fi action film. When posting a "SPOILER" you can highlight the spoiler part of your text, then click on the little eyeball icon in the text toolbar. This will then hide that part of your post unless people click on it. I did it for you this time. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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