What was the last classic martial-arts film you watched?

[DrNgor]

14 minutes ago, TibetanWhiteCrane said:

Though was FOF really responsible for the Japan-bashing wave in the way most people seem to think? Jimmy had already done it in a few films (Chinese Boxer, Furious Slaughter), Chor Yuen did it in The Killer, Chang Cheh had done it in The Angry Guest and King Boxer opened about a month after FOF so obviously already in the can. I'm not disputing that FOF wasn't partially responsible for the popularization of the China VS Japan theme that "plagued"  the genre in the early 70's, but I think it rode the wave more than started it. Of course one can say that the battle lines were more defined in FOF as it dealt with the actual Japanese occupation whereas most earlier examples had Japanese-for-hire fighters brought in by local villains. Anyways, just my thoughts.

I agree with you. Movies like Bloody Fists and King Boxer came out after FoF, but owe a lot more to The Chinese Boxer in terms of their story and portrayal of the Japanese. I do think Fist of Fury was the first to show that the oppressive power of the Japanese was just as much, if not more, political than purely martial artistic. That's why I equated The Big Fight to Fist of Fury: it's set during the Second Sino-Japanese war and much of evil stems from the Japanese being able to rape and kill at a whim with no legal repercussions, international or otherwise. That's more in line with FoF's portrayal of the Japanese exploiting the laws of the Shanghai International Settlement to their own ends.

[TibetanWhiteCrane]

2 minutes ago, DrNgor said:

I agree with you. Movies like Bloody Fists and King Boxer came out after FoF, but owe a lot more to The Chinese Boxer in terms of their story and portrayal of the Japanese. I do think Fist of Fury was the first to show that the oppressive power of the Japanese was just as much, if not more, political than purely martial artistic. That's why I equated The Big Fight to Fist of Fury: it's set during the Second Sino-Japanese war and much of evil stems from the Japanese being able to rape and kill at a whim with no legal repercussions, international or otherwise. That's more in line with FoF's portrayal of the Japanese exploiting the laws of the Shanghai International Settlement to their own ends.

True... that's really where it differs.

[ShawAngela]

17 hours ago, DrNgor said:

The Big Fight (1972) - Roc Tien Peng was almost like the Taiwanese Jimmy Wang Yu, before Jimmy Wang Yu set up shop in Taiwan, with his questionable skills and lack of leading man looks. This is a violent and sleazy film, and probably one of the earliest films to capitalize on the success and themes of Fist of Fury (it left theaters a week before Hap Ki Do reached theaters).

I'm not sure to have well understood what you wrote here. Do you mean that Roc Tien doesn't have good skills and lacks of talent ?

17 hours ago, DrNgor said:

nfernal Street (1973) -  Another Taiwanese anti-Japanese film starring Yu Tien-Lung, who also choreographed. The film was released in May 1973, about two months before Bruce died. And yet, the film is obviously exploiting Fist of Fury, both in its anti-Japanese themes and in Yu Tien-Lung's portrayal of the protagonist, which has Bruce Lee's Chen Zhen written all over it. The fighting is very much early 70s basher, although you can tell Yu Tien_lung has some real, if untapped, talent.

I watched this not long ago, and I didn't have the feeling that it was an anti-Japanese focused movie, but rather an anti-opium focused movie, thought of course, as it's the Japanese who run the opium traffic, the two are linked.

I hadn't noticed that there might be an obvious comparison between Yu Tien Lung's character and Chen Zhen, maybe you are right and I should revisit this movie again...Which will be a pleasure, since I love Yu Tien Lung, and you are right, he has a real talent for the fights.

Did you see any of his other movies ? I think that he has a particular way of fighting and his "en garde" postures aren't the same as the other actors, and all his fights in any of the movies I saw him in are very furious and powerful. I think that he really is a great and underrated actor.

Now that I'm writing this, I wonder if he could have been thought of being a "Bruce Lee's replacement" by some directors ? Does anyone have any clue about this ?

[DrNgor]

5 hours ago, ShawAngela said:

Did you see any of his other movies ?

I've seen Ma Su Chen and Duel with Samurai, both of which he choreographed. I thought the latter was surprisingly inventive for a Taiwanese wuxia made in 1971.

 

5 hours ago, ShawAngela said:

I'm not sure to have well understood what you wrote here. Do you mean that Roc Tien doesn't have good skills and lacks of talent ?

He's a solid actor, but his martial arts skills are lacking. His fights were definitely the least interesting of what was on display.

[ShawAngela]

2 hours ago, DrNgor said:

8 hours ago, ShawAngela said:

Did you see any of his other movies ?

I've seen Ma Su Chen and Duel with Samurai, both of which he choreographed. I thought the latter was surprisingly inventive for a Taiwanese wuxia made in 1971.

 

Yes, both very good movies and well choreographied. But he doesn't play in them, if I remember well...

 

You should check Dragon kid, Insanity being, Bamboo brotherhood, Shaolin thief (I haven't seen these two, but I'll watch them soon) and maybe a few other ones that I don't remember very well...

2 hours ago, DrNgor said:

8 hours ago, ShawAngela said:

I'm not sure to have well understood what you wrote here. Do you mean that Roc Tien doesn't have good skills and lacks of talent ?

He's a solid actor, but his martial arts skills are lacking. His fights were definitely the least interesting of what was on display.

Thanks for the explanation.

[DiP]

The Big Boss (1971) - 8/10

Fist of Fury (1972) - 7.5/10

The Way of the Dragon (1972) - 8/10

Enter the Dragon (1973) - 8/10

[Yihetuan]

Mad, Mad, Mad Swords [1969] - Dir. Wong Tin-lam

Amusing and generally entertaining kung fu comedy from Cathay with some decent gags and played for laughs. Tin Ching is the lead and he has a bit of a Jerry Lewis aura about him in this one which is not a bad thing! To be honest, I've never particularly cared for him or paid attention to him before as he's usually typecast as the smarmy, conniving background character in his later Shaw Brothers roles or he plays a dastardly villain who backstabs the hero at an inopportune moment. While he still carries a bit of the crafty, scheming persona of his Shaw roles, he's much more sympathetic here as the hero of the movie. The sword fight scenes aren't anything special as they are pretty rudimentary & basic with a lot of undercranking but the fights aren't the reason to watch this but instead it's for the broad comedy and the clever ways Tin Ching comes up with to defeat his vastly superior skilled opponents - including one who resembles the One Armed Swordsman and another lampooning Zatoichi, the blind swordsman.

I watched this on the really nice looking custom blu ray put out recently by @TheKungFuRobber which allows one to choose the OAR 2.35:1 or an open matte version. Also features very legible & grammatically correct English subtitles.

[AbeRudder]

On 8/15/2020 at 9:26 AM, Liersi said:

Another new 88 Films relaease: Dragon Lord (1982). It's too bad they couldn't release The Young Master as well, because now I'm dying to rewatch it in good quality. These films are all different than I remember them. A lot less kung fu than you'd think! Here there's almost none left. There's no traditional kung fu of any kind, simply because Jackie and his good friend Mars have skipped all classes and posess no advanced skills. Instead they have attitude to spare, and brains the size of very small birds. Dragon Lord plays like a film that wasn't meant to be an entry in the classic fu cannon, but a modern day farce. Extended sports sequences and comedic hijinx crowd out all possibility for a fight, and when the finale happens, it's all angry fu, general athleticism and Jackie's trademark stubborn refusal to die. Lots of power, though, as poor stuntmen are brutally whipped across rooms like cannonballs. You can tell Jackie's heart was everywhere but kung fu. Reportedly overshot and then edited down, the plot is a mess without real direction. There's Chen Huimin (Chan Wai Man) as a smuggler who valiantly refuses to smuggle Chinese antiques, Whang In Sik as his boss, and just about everyone you know in bit parts scattered across the film. There's an entire shuttlecock match in there, completely random, people surface and disappear without rhyme or reason, and the only thing holding it all together is that Jackie and Mars somehow stumble into everything. Yeah, this is like they were shooting a different movie, maybe two, and then had to come up with a device to cobble it all together. Thankfully there are a lot of individually great ideas in the film, they just don't flow together. It's still a treasure trove of fun if you don't mind the scattershot plotting and the mood swings. It has Jackie perennial favourite topic of Chinese antiques being smuggled, some great early visual gags and some truly brutal stuntwork. It's also genuinely funny in parts! Every time the two dads get super angry, and Jackie, Mars and their respective servants (they're rich kids) look away in shame had me laughing. The ending bit is the best! How they hide behind the wall and then come in like a pair of nuclear zombies It's also a nice love letter to Mars, who does well as Jackie's equal. More of a dry run for Project A than classic fu, but Whang In Sik makes sure it earns its place in this category.

One thing I love about Young Master is the contrast between the detailed prop fighting sequences, which have some of Jackie's most intricate choreography, and the Whang In Sik scenes. The fight with Yuen Biao for instance feels like more of a show of prowess and skill than a fight, it's actually quite slow in pace and there is very little power in the movements (I don't say this as a criticism, I love this kind of stuff personally). Then Whang In Sik turns up and everything takes on a different character. There are quite a few takes in the final fight between Jackie and Whang which are quite long but aren't crisply choreographed at all like his later stuff, they are just wild exchanges. 

 

[sym8]

5 hours ago, AbeRudder said:

One thing I love about Young Master is the contrast between the detailed prop fighting sequences, which have some of Jackie's most intricate choreography, and the Whang In Sik scenes. The fight with Yuen Biao for instance feels like more of a show of prowess and skill than a fight, it's actually quite slow in pace and there is very little power in the movements (I don't say this as a criticism, I love this kind of stuff personally). Then Whang In Sik turns up and everything takes on a different character. There are quite a few takes in the final fight between Jackie and Whang which are quite long but aren't crisply choreographed at all like his later stuff, they are just wild exchanges. 

 

I think by the time Jackie had got to Young master he was getting fed up with the shapes kinda choreography and started to move away from it.Like you said you get some of it in the movie but everything with Whang In Sik is more of a brawl/power display and by the time he got to Dragon Lord he was done with the shapes altogether.

[YnEoS]

On 8/15/2020 at 1:29 PM, TibetanWhiteCrane said:

Though was FOF really responsible for the Japan-bashing wave in the way most people seem to think? Jimmy had already done it in a few films (Chinese Boxer, Furious Slaughter), Chor Yuen did it in The Killer, Chang Cheh had done it in The Angry Guest and King Boxer opened about a month after FOF so obviously already in the can. I'm not disputing that FOF wasn't partially responsible for the popularization of the China VS Japan theme that "plagued"  the genre in the early 70's, but I think it rode the wave more than started it. Of course one can say that the battle lines were more defined in FOF as it dealt with the actual Japanese occupation whereas most earlier examples had Japanese-for-hire fighters brought in by local villains. Anyways, just my thoughts.

I think this goes back before Shaw Brothers started producing wuxia and kung fu regularly, as another of other genres dealt with the occupation.  I watched most Shaw Brothers films from 1965, and King Hu's war film Sons of the Good Earth and Law Chun's melodrama Vermilion Door depict the occupation in similar ways as later action films would, and I imagine you could find other examples going further back, and in the interim.

[TibetanWhiteCrane]

48 minutes ago, YnEoS said:

I think this goes back before Shaw Brothers started producing wuxia and kung fu regularly, as another of other genres dealt with the occupation.  I watched most Shaw Brothers films from 1965, and King Hu's war film Sons of the Good Earth and Law Chun's melodrama Vermilion Door depict the occupation in similar ways as later action films would, and I imagine you could find other examples going further back, and in the interim.

Well, yes, but I meant specifically regarding the Kung Fu genre. Although even there you can go back to stuff like Wong Fei-Hung: The Conqueror of the 'Sam-hong Gang and a bunch of other stuff featuring villains of Nipponese persuasion. Regarding depictions of occupation and problematic Sino-Japanese relations in general, there are many examples such as those you mention.

[ShawAngela]

On 8/17/2020 at 5:59 AM, Yihetuan said:

Tin Ching is the lead and he has a bit of a Jerry Lewis aura about him in this one which is not a bad thing! To be honest, I've never particularly cared for him or paid attention to him before as he's usually typecast as the smarmy, conniving background character in his later Shaw Brothers roles or he plays a dastardly villain who backstabs the hero at an inopportune moment.

You should check his other Cathay's movies. I discovered that he played very serious roles when he was at Cathay, at least in the wuxia movies he played in, and he also played in some comedic-musicals movies, still for Cathay, and was good at it.

I can recommend Jade dragon for the wuxias and Mad about music for the musicals, if I remember well.

That's true that his roles in the Shaws' movies were a total change in comparison to what he played in the Cathay movies...

Edited August 18, 2020 by ShawAngela

[ShawAngela]

I discovered Right overcomes might today and I enjoyed it a lot, though my favorite star of the moment Yu Tien Lung disappears from the movie after the first 20 mn (in which he has 3 or 4 fights !).

It's a shame that the actress' name isn't even mentioned in the cast on hkmdb, though she plays an important role and has a great fight !

I got it as a Jamal project, with both the Arabian release with French subtitles and the Korean release. I should have begun by watching the Korean release, because the quality of the picture is much better than the Arabic print. Something strange is that the Arabic print lasts for 1h17mn and a few seconds, while the Korean print lasts for 1h18mn and a few seconds, and I didn't see any added scene...

Lung Fei and Li Chiang play the villains, as usual, and Wang Hsieh plays a white haired villain who seems to have problems with his neck, since each time he is about to fight, he twists his neck !!

[paimeifist]

Swift Shaolin Boxer

This movie was a good fight fest, and the plot was interesting at times. A “general” is sending “agents” to a town to do “something” about a group of rebels led by Lo Lieh. Yes, it’s not clear who is really good or bad, it’s not clear what these two groups are, and it’s not even clear what the “general” is even sending agents to actually do.

Anyway, all of the agents end of stopping at the same inn where the rebels keep a group planted, led by Shih Chung-Tien. Angela Mao also works at this inn, and seems to be aiding the bad guys. After the rebels take down two of the government agents, we flash to some scenes of Barry Chan on a adventure that seem unrelated to the movie. First he fights some group of golden Buddha kid in a temple and they give him a talisman. Later, he is fighting in some kind of tournament in a field FILLED with flags. After he defeats 4 or 5 people, the last one tells him “He has passed the test, and has proven himself worthy of working for the emperor”.

So hes the next agent sent to the mysterious inn..

There is a huge twist at the end with no context whatsoever, and it’s completely nonsensical. I had already given up on the plot due to the three mostly random fantasy scenes (golden Buddha kids, flag tournament, and a hopping vampires scene). So this was just another thing to laugh at, it’s a shame because the main story I described above was actually kind of interesting.

Overall I enjoyed this movie, laughing at the random fantasy scenes thrown into the plot, and enjoying the fight fest featuring mostly Angela Mao and Barry Chan, who both looked really good here. The movie advertises Chia Ling, but she basically isn’t in it. Heck the amazon description makes it sound like Angela Mao and Chia Ling are teaming up, that’s why I watched it! Lo Lieh did his typical independent film role, showing up for less than a minute, then the final fight, which he performed pretty well in here.

 

Edited August 19, 2020 by paimeifist

[ShawAngela]

12 minutes ago, paimeifist said:

The movie advertises Chia Ling, but she basically isn’t in it.

 

12 minutes ago, paimeifist said:

and it’s completely nonsensical.

Yes, the plot seems nonsensical, but maybe watched in the original language, it makes sense if there are explanations in the dialogues that haven't been well translated or non translated at all...

Chia Ling is like Lo Lieh, she appears at the end and has very few to do, a shame...!!

[paimeifist]

1 hour ago, ShawAngela said:

 

Yes, the plot seems nonsensical, but maybe watched in the original language, it makes sense if there are explanations in the dialogues that haven't been well translated or non translated at all...

Chia Ling is like Lo Lieh, she appears at the end and has very few to do, a shame...!!

I can imagine the twist MAY be a bit better in original language, but I have a feeling the plot may still be a bit nonsensical. The golden Buddha kid and hopping vampire scenes really felt disconnected - not that it matters much, they were entertaining!

 

I want to see more of Chia Ling, she is a bad chick!

[ShawAngela]

5 hours ago, paimeifist said:

I want to see more of Chia Ling, she is a bad chick!

Did you watch Female chivalry ? It was the first movie she played in that I saw as a teenager in a cinema, and her name became engraved in my memory at once, as it had happened with Chiao Chiao when I first saw her in Dragon blows !

Just to be sure...I guess that you watched Queen boxer, right ?

Here are some of my favorite Chia Ling's movies ; you can't go wrong when watching a movie in which she is the lead...

 

The avenger (Queen boxer)

The escape in which she pairs again with Peter Yang Kwan

Girl named Iron Phoenix

Imprudent Iron Phoenix

Supergirl fo kung fu

Crazy acrobat

Female chivalry

Heores behind the enemies lines, in which she pairs with Shan Kuan Ling Fung

Assassin

Seven spirits pagoda

Heroine Kan Lian Chu

The great hunter

The Ming patriots

The lantern street

The double double crossers

The martyrs

The shaolin invincibles

The lady constables

 

There are a few movies that I still nee to watch or revisit in order to see if they are worth a recommendation, but the above ones are really worth watching...

[paimeifist]

@ShawAngela Wow! Thanks for that list, that’s awesome. I have a screen shot of it for reference. 😎 

 

The only movie I’ve seen there is “Ming Patriots” I believe, which was fairly good!

 

Sounds like Queen Boxer should be next on my list of Chia Ling movies to watch?

[ShawAngela]

21 minutes ago, paimeifist said:

Sounds like Queen Boxer should be next on my list of Chia Ling movies to watch?

I can't believe that you haven't watched this movie as yet !!

It's Ma Su Chen 's story with a lot of excellent fights in which Chia Ling is at her best !!

From what I read somewhere, she was cast as Judy Lee in this movie and she was even presented as Bruce Lee's sister in magazines (if I'm not mistaken) in order to capitalize on this latter's big fame, I guess...

[Liersi]

I'm catching up on first viewings  of fu classics that I've spent decades waiting on good releases that will never come, so here goes Crystal Fist (1979): my second Billy Chong (Zhuang Quanli) after Sun Dragon. I'd heard good things about him, and it's true. As few movies as he made, this guy was one of the best of his generation in terms of precise movements, sure-footedness and his ability to portray technique with enough aggression and speed to make it look like combat, and not like a demonstration. They were clearly trying to set him up as Jackie Number 2, with his hairdo here and the plot being a straight copy of the DM/SITES formula including Yuen Siu-tin (Yuan Xiaotian) and copious amounts of unfunny comedy. It doesn't work for anything but the fighting, but the fighting works tremendously well. I'd go as far as saying that Billy Chong gives me the one thing I sometimes miss in the Jackie outings, and sometimes in classic fu choreography in general: straight up aggression. No matter what Billy does, he always looks like he's trying to beat your ass. This is also why I believe that the comedy format in Crystal Fist doesn't really play to his strengths. It's a testament to his qualities as an athlete and screen fighter that it's as entertaining as it is, but I found myself wishing for a pre-comedy kung fu movie with him. When Billy Chong gets serious, he's one of the best athletic movers and strikers I've seen. In short: somewhat tired DM-like with too much inane comedy and not enough serious fighting, elevated by truly excellent serious fighting with a nice balance of acrobatics and aggression.

What did you guys think of this one?

[DrNgor]

2 minutes ago, Liersi said:

but I found myself wishing for a pre-comedy kung fu movie with him.

He's in Black Belt Karate, but he doesn't fight very much in it.

2 minutes ago, Liersi said:

What did you guys think of this one?

I reviewed this one back in the day.

 

[Liersi]

8 minutes ago, DrNgor said:

He's in Black Belt Karate, but he doesn't fight very much in it.

I reviewed this one back in the day.

 

Cheers for that! Great write-up, and very much in line with my experience. The fighting was up to par, but the rest felt both tired and overlong. It's interesting that you mentioned Hell's Wind Staff in your review. I rewatched that the other day and wrote about it in here. That one is a bit lighter on the aggression (Mang Hoi in particular), but strikes a better balance overall. So it's not as simple as being tired of the formula. I've been tired of that for ages

[ShawAngela]

5 hours ago, Liersi said:

I'm catching up on first viewings  of fu classics that I've spent decades waiting on good releases that will never come, so here goes Crystal Fist (1979): my second Billy Chong (Zhuang Quanli) after Sun Dragon. I'd heard good things about him, and it's true. As few movies as he made, this guy was one of the best of his generation in terms of precise movements, sure-footedness and his ability to portray technique with enough aggression and speed to make it look like combat, and not like a demonstration. They were clearly trying to set him up as Jackie Number 2, with his hairdo here and the plot being a straight copy of the DM/SITES formula including Yuen Siu-tin (Yuan Xiaotian) and copious amounts of unfunny comedy. It doesn't work for anything but the fighting, but the fighting works tremendously well. I'd go as far as saying that Billy Chong gives me the one thing I sometimes miss in the Jackie outings, and sometimes in classic fu choreography in general: straight up aggression. No matter what Billy does, he always looks like he's trying to beat your ass. This is also why I believe that the comedy format in Crystal Fist doesn't really play to his strengths. It's a testament to his qualities as an athlete and screen fighter that it's as entertaining as it is, but I found myself wishing for a pre-comedy kung fu movie with him. When Billy Chong gets serious, he's one of the best athletic movers and strikers I've seen. In short: somewhat tired DM-like with too much inane comedy and not enough serious fighting, elevated by truly excellent serious fighting with a nice balance of acrobatics and aggression.

What did you guys think of this one?

This is one of Billy Chong's movies I haven't see as yet, but I bought the German dvd and I should receive it on tomorrow.

I discovered him in Sun dragon, and as soon as I finished it, I checked Billy Chong's filmography and I began to buy his movies one by one, and I never got tired of watching him ! He is a true gem by himself and has a honorable place in my list of favorite actors !

And in addition to that, he is very good looking ! I love his smile !

 

I'm glad that you wrote such kind comments about him !

Edited August 21, 2020 by ShawAngela

[sym8]

6 hours ago, Liersi said:

I'm catching up on first viewings  of fu classics that I've spent decades waiting on good releases that will never come, so here goes Crystal Fist (1979): my second Billy Chong (Zhuang Quanli) after Sun Dragon. I'd heard good things about him, and it's true. As few movies as he made, this guy was one of the best of his generation in terms of precise movements, sure-footedness and his ability to portray technique with enough aggression and speed to make it look like combat, and not like a demonstration. They were clearly trying to set him up as Jackie Number 2, with his hairdo here and the plot being a straight copy of the DM/SITES formula including Yuen Siu-tin (Yuan Xiaotian) and copious amounts of unfunny comedy. It doesn't work for anything but the fighting, but the fighting works tremendously well. I'd go as far as saying that Billy Chong gives me the one thing I sometimes miss in the Jackie outings, and sometimes in classic fu choreography in general: straight up aggression. No matter what Billy does, he always looks like he's trying to beat your ass. This is also why I believe that the comedy format in Crystal Fist doesn't really play to his strengths. It's a testament to his qualities as an athlete and screen fighter that it's as entertaining as it is, but I found myself wishing for a pre-comedy kung fu movie with him. When Billy Chong gets serious, he's one of the best athletic movers and strikers I've seen. In short: somewhat tired DM-like with too much inane comedy and not enough serious fighting, elevated by truly excellent serious fighting with a nice balance of acrobatics and aggression.

What did you guys think of this one?

Agree with your comments,why oh why didn’t this guy make more of these movies.Sun Dragon,Super Power,Crystal Fist And Fistful Of Talons are all great entertainment with great choreography and he can definitely bust a move.👍

[ShawAngela]

Return of the kung fu dragon : I had downloaded an English language version from the public domain years ago, and I remember that I was a little bit disappointed by this movie at that time. I watched today a Mandarin version with English subtitles and I enjoyed it more.

Demons in Flame Mountain : I bought this movie because of Hu Chin, but she doesn't have much to do in this movie, telling the story of the Red Kid and his brother the Yellow Kid...

Ghost of the night crow : A much more interesting movie, in which Chang Yi is credited as the lead,b ut only appears at the beginning of the movie, and at around 1h05mn for a movie which lasts for only around 1h15mn ! Tieng Feng appears at the very end, playing the same character he played int he movie Filial son, which makes me wonder if the two movies are related...

The great chase : Japanese movie with Etsuko Shihomi at her best !! Great action movie !