Hard Revenge Milly & Bloody Battle

[Takuma]

From what I remember there isn't a single drop of CG blood in either one of the films. On the contrary, these are old school show cases with fantastic practical effects.

[ShaOW!linDude]

Hey, Takuma.

I didn't know you'd stuck my reviews for this over here. Cool! Thanks.

[KUNG FU BOB]

Okay, I finally watched these, back to back. I thought they were immensely entertaining, with the second one trumping the first.

Here comes, perhaps a record-breaking number of quotes/comments. Please forgive me, I came into this thread very late. But it has a bunch of great posts by some cool people that I wanted to respond to...

This seemed to deserve a topic of its own. After all, Bloody Battle is the best Japanese action film in more than 15 years.

I can't completely agree with that statement. However, I would say "Bloody Battle is one of the best Japanese action films in more than 15 years.

Please tell me you haven't seen 2LDK, Dead or Alive (1999), Fudoh, Princess Blade, Versus, When the Last Sword is Drawn, or Zatoichi.

For those that haven't seen 2LDK... see it.

Still..... I'll keep watching. These films are still giving us a new avenue for Japanese action that we wouldn't really get otherwise; a country that once gave us Lone wolf and cub and Sonny Chiba should not have tokusatsu kid shows as the highlight of its action industry!

Amen!

As for my vote of the best Japanese action film of the past 15 years.. It's hard. Most of the best ones are dramas first and foremost, like The Twilight Samurai.

A brilliant film. But as you say, I would not even call it an action film. For me, it's a straight up drama with a few minutes of exquisite action.

I would probably go with Jiu jitsu, since the main reason I think it was made was for Kurata to show his action team was the best in Japan, and just describing it is a contradiction: it's a japanese film with multiple, long, complicated, martial arts scenes, and with evenly skilled good guys and bad guys.

This is probably my number 1 choice for best Japanese action as well.

Why hasn't anyone subbed this!!!! The fights are phenomenal. I bow to you Kurata. You are awesome Sensei!

The film is indeed very bloody. It's not a splatter film, but the director is a devoted fan of ultra-violence, and he used Nishimura Eizo (Tokyo Gore Police + every single other gore film from the past decade) for the special effects. Still, IMO it's clearly an action movie supported by gore effects, rather than the other way round.

I put off watching this for a long time because, other than MACHINE GIRL, which I liked a lot, I was not enjoying the plethora of low-budget, splatter for splatter's sake, Japanese action/horror films with poorly choreographed martial arts that were flooding the scene. HRM 1 and 2 looked like more of the same to me, so I avoided it. But it was way better than I had expected.

One of the great things about Bloody Battle is that it's handmade - special effects and action. CGI is only used in a couple of futuristic background shots. The blood and gore is all traditional handwork, and action relies more on real skill than editing tricks.

Agree 100%. The CGI gore really turns me off. I would have thought that it would be a great tool to add to prosthetics work, but it's hardly ever used well. Totally dug it in NINJA ASSASSIN, though I know most people criticized that FX work pretty harshly.

The katana-melee festival Kilico in Kill (2008) (yet another Mamoro Oshii omnibus movie) shows more promise in terms of action. However, Kilico has quite low production values, almost zero storyline, and owes too much to Versus and Kill Bill.

Added to my "must see" list.

I have yet to see 'Bloody Battle', however I agree with John in I thought that Tak Sakaguchi was going to be Japan's new action hope having watched 'Versus'. The guy has the skills and is a talented fighter, and I thought there would be a Japan action cinema renaissance with he and Kane Kosugi, who I had also watched in 'Muscle/Blood Heat' around the same time as 'Versus'. The next Chiba & Kurata!....but alas it never happened.

You and me both brother!

My vote currently for the best Japanese action movie of the last 15 years though, based on purely an action perspective, would have to be 'Death Trance'. A cool little movie which put the action choreographer of 'Versus', Yuji Shimomura, in the directors chair, brought back star Tak Sakaguchi in a vaguely similar role, and basically threw him in the middle of the same forest as 'Versus', stripped away all the sci-fi elements, and replaced them with non-stop fighting and Steven Seagal's son with a bazooka. A fun day at the movies!

Oh... I've been sitting on this one for years. Going on my buddy Emeraldforest's rec, I have this one slated for tonight's movie. He's been telling me to watch this for a long time. I even have the nice Tokyo Shock tin version and everything. Just didn't feel "in the mood" for it. Funny that after at least a year of Emeraldforest saying "watch it!" I should read O-AB's thoughts on it on the day that I'm ready to finally check it out. LOL Well, two guys who's opinions I trust... it's gotta be good!

As for comparing the two I think Bloody Battle is visually more stylish (than VERSUS): the cinematography is superior, the film is visually better looking, and the sets are more stylish. Tsujimoto has superior sense of style and some eye for details and atmosphere. The pacing is also better. As are the gore effects.

Versus is great fun but Kitamura has little patience or eye for creating atmoshere... he mainly throws in a dozen guys and tells them to fight for 10 minutes. Then, next scene: have the same 10 guys fight again. Somewhere in the process he loses some of the intensity. Bloody Battle has more of the 70's karate / chambara film spirit where every strike could potentially kill you. The action scenes are more intense. In Versus you kinda know these same guys are still gonna be fighting after 15 minutes because they can hardly do any damage to each other.

Here's a few example's of Tsujimoto's visual skill, taken from one of the film's first scenes

Superb framing and use of depth, as well as lights and shadows. Horizontal camera movement adds the final touch.

As fun as VERSUS is, I agree. When hundreds of blows are thrown without doing any damage, I lose any sense of danger and excitement. I like when Chiba-san or Bruce hit someone, bones broke, internal organs exploded, et.

As far as the look of the Milly films, I was surprised at the quality as well. For such low-budget genre movies I didn't expect to see such nice composition, light and camera work.

(dammit, my post as long as an average Kitamura film. Loses intensity in the process )

I enjoyed your post way more than the last four Kitamura films that I watched.

Kitamura is definately immature as a director. I think he put the brunt of his creative energy into Versus and hasn't re-cultivated that passion since. But his debut is still a frentic if frivilrous feature.

Very well put John. You nailed it. I was such a fan of VERSUS that I drug along everyone I knew to see it at it's festival screenings. I probably saw it ten times in that first month (I think three times in the theater). After that, each of his films got progressively worse! I wrote about him a few times. The last article was never run because they said I was too hard on him.

No arguing at the superior cinematography, but as this isn't exclusively the domain of the action film I should think Kitamura's sufficient. Rather, I would contend that the cast in Versus, particularly Tak Sakaguchi, deliver much more convincing movement in their fights. The bloodletting that accompanies the violence is also less the garden hose school of gore, and I think this leaning in the direction of realism lends damage a punch BB doesn't have. It also gives the over-the-top bits space to breathe a bit; the first time you see that guy just EXPLODE like an RPG hit him or punch through the head it's more of an acceleration than just seeing blood sprinklers every time. And while I'd agree that he could let up on the back-to-back action, I've got to give Kitamura credit for inserting tension between those scenes. In BB, what was there to keep me edging off my seat? The stakes weren't that high; Milly is a killing machine and we never doubt her. She also has to be a strong silent time that doesn't really get a chance to make me care about her. I don't particularly care about her "cub" either. At least with someone like Oogami Itto he emotes and interacts in a way that we experience some of his pain and get to know the character. Milly isn't entirely unsympathetic, but she is a little synthetic. I felt like I got to know Tak and Hideo Sakaki's characters. Their ages long conflict really added a dimension to their confrontation.

Good points. I think with less "gyser" gore from Milly, and more "impact" from VERSUS, we could have a perfect merging of the two styles. So let's get Gareth "THE RAID" Evans to direct Iko, Tak, Kurata, High Kick Girl, Milly, and Kosugi in a new classic... ASAP.

The Japanese action scene was on life support for a while, so I'm glad as anyone at least someone is doing something about it. Nevertheless, I think where the actual action is concerned, BB is still sophomoric. It's not a slight against the people behind it; as if it isn't hard enough to capture convincing combat on film, weapons demand expertise. Neither cast was plentiful with Tomisaburou Wakayamas, but I'd definately give props to Versus for getting a little closer.

Personally, I thought the weapon's work was better in the Milly films.

It also makes things like Azumi all the more painful... I think if the karate people from Black Belt combine with the team from Bloody Battle and make say, Black Belt Bloody Battle, true magic will happen based on the alliteration alone.

Though I'm seemingly surrounded by AZUMI fans, I find it to be an extremely weak and disappointing film. My wife is a 2nd grade teacher, and she wields the nunchaku in a much more convincingly badass fashion that that frail little girl that played AZUMI ever managed to swing a katana. AZUMI was a real eye-roller for me.

Your collaboration idea sounds perfect.

And I gotta reveal a secret. I LOVE AZUMI. You wouldn't know what kind of impact Aya Ueto had an a (back then) 17 year old guy. And how many photobooks, posters, dvds etc. would be purchased in the following few years Haven't seen it for many years, though.

I'm sure if I'd seen it at 17 I would have loved it too. Unfortunately, for me, it wasn't a great film to see in your thirties. I'd be curious to hear what you think of it now if you give it another look.

Finally saw Hard Revenge Milly last night and I have to say, found it to be an interminable bore.

Hope Bloody Battle is the vast improvement people say it is.

I'm shocked bro! Have you seen the sequel now?

I don't know what it is about the gore in all these recent splatter flicks, but the only word I can think of is "fake". But it's weird, because most gore isn't very realistic. Maybe it's because of the plasticky way in which it's done; when I see it just screams out "Aha! See THAT? We're totally KUH-RAY-ZEE". It's almost the same feeling as when some films exposit a bunch of characterization really awkwardly ("well, as your mother I..."). Or maybe it's just because I'm so used to the traditional syrup/red paint-looking blood that this variety is so strange. Weird.

Same here. When I see a head explode in something like SCANNERS, it's incredible. It has feeling behind it, it's part of a scene, it has meaning. When I watched MEATBALL MACHINE I felt like I was just seeing an endless reel of somebody spraying cranberry juice all over a bunch of rubber body parts. It did nothing for me.

Let's pause for a rant, shall we?...

What is the deal with all of the bad fake blood in so many movies? The father of modern makeup FX, Dick Smith (THE EXORCIST, THE GODFATHER) mastered the formula for ultra-realistic stage blood back in the '70s (nothing fake looking about the carnage in TAXI DRIVER, right?) and made it public. Yet in scores of films the blood either looks way too watery, like juice, or extra thick like syrup. Everyone in the world has cut or pricked their finger. See that? It's blood. Now you know what it looks like. It's not cranberry juice, and it's not maroon engine oil. Get it right people!

Regarding BLACK BELT...

Interesting....I actually enjoyed the finale for precisely the reason you & John didn't enjoy it. The fight was realistic in tone with the rest of the movie in the sense that both fighters became increasinly exhausted, and as the fight wore on in real time it became less and less about technique and skill, and more about just 2 humans trying to overpower each other, despite having barely enough breath to stand.

I sometimes like these realistic touches to movies....like the scene with Sammo Hung during the final fight of 'Enter the Fat Dragon', when he stops the fight simply so he can keel over and get his breath back....very different movie, but it still adds that touch of realism to the proceedings.

I feel the same way. When two extremely skilled fighters go at it, it makes sense that the fight would lead to exaustion before a clear victory. These bits were welcome for me. Another good one is when JC sits down for a second in the middle of the fight with Benny The Jet in WHEELS ON MEALS.

Still in reference to BLACK BELT...

Ok, watched this one last night. It's not bad... but not that good either. The film starts out well once you get over the terrible introduction texts. Realistic karate is always a feast. The storyline is what it is, but works well enough cause you don't have to take it too seriously...

...until after halway. Then the film starts sinking deeper into pretentious b-grade drama. Zero vision from the director, but instead an attempt to prove they are making "a serious movie". The use of b/w image came out as a terribly prenetious attempt to be artistic. The wise and philosophical speeches at the end are also embarrasing...

Haha ha! I hear you brother. It worked for me, but I hear where you're coming from.

... which is a very amusing paradox. The 1970's karate cheese burgers might have had some similar speeches, but those films were unashamedly fun b-films... those speeches were just cool... and after the film, you sometimes might even think that hey, that was an awesome silly movie, but that quote had a point to it... more so than the filmmakers ever intended. Call it giving inspiration.

Great point. I'll never forget watching THE KILLING MACHINE and enjoying that Royale with cheese, then suddenly Chiba-san's character realizes "the true meaning of the martial arts" and I got the chills. I remember thinking "That was deep. But didn't a guy's dick get cut off and fed to a dog a half hour ago in this same movie?".

For me, the HARD REVENGE MILLY films were like less tongue-in-cheek versions of the SISTER STREETFIGHTER films, but way more graphic in their depictions of the damage that these kinds of fights would do to people's bodies. The gore went over the top, like LONE WOLF AND CUB violence, but on PCP! The blood looked more realistic than in the last twenty Japanese films I've watched. The star looks like a young Michelle Yeoh with red hair and she uses nunchaku. The martial arts choreography was wicked and low on wirework. Shit... I'm a fan!

[John]

You know what? I just want more freakin' chambara films. With that up my ass, I probably wasn't fertile ground for Milly...er, what I mean is I'll have to pop it in again sometime.

[JimPV]

Gave these a watch last night and really enjoyed them. They created quite a nice dystopian feeling on what was certainly a low budget; and the gore was over the top but not quite as silly as Machine Girl, etc.

And it just occurred to me (after a little googling) that Miki Mizuno was the lead in Gamera II: Advent of Legion(!). She looked herself in the quick shot at the beginning in the car (where she's remembering her past happy life), but the new hair and brooding performance as Milly really made her look different than the chipper ingenue of Gamera II.

All in all, definitely worth a watch. I think I'll pick up the disc for the ol' collection.

Oh, and don't forget...