Most impressive remastered Kung Fu classics!

[TheFlyingPanda]

I was watching HKL's Hapkido on DVD again and thinking "what a great print" I remember watching my VHS cropped, blurry version of it I've had since I was twelve. Celestial's "Five Deadly Venoms" puts a smile on my face every time I watch it on a big screen TV. The thing is, aside from the big SB collection that got lucky to be remastered. What old school classics like Legend of A fighter and Hapkido has received the most impressive remastered print to date?

Any opinions?

[mpm74]

I was really surprised in the Blu-ray release of the BIG BOSS.

And, basically, any Celestial/IVL/Whatever release. Those are all top.

[Guest WuxiaFan]

Most of HKL's prints are flawless, but most are out of print, too. The best places to find HKL discs are amazon.co.uk and chaos.com out of Australia. The Australian HKL discs are distributed by Magna Pacific. They are PAL, R4 discs.

Joy Sales/Fortune Star also does an excellent job with their Legendary Collection releases. Their prints are beautiful and they've released a lot of classic kung fu movies, especially Angela Mao movies. The best source for these discs is at dddhouse.com. These are all NTSC R0 discs.

[TheFlyingPanda]

The legendary collection dose have some great prints. I recently ordered "The Challenger" and "The Loot". I've never shopped at DVDhouse, but I'll try it out. I usually go to buyoyo or Sensasian, if I don't find it in Chinatown NY. Cantonen Iron Kung Fu looks fantasic and I don't think it was remasterd! The Bruce Lee HKL films are the best I've seen so far, haven't seen the Blue Ray Big Boss yet.

[David Rees]

HK Legends are great, most are OOP but as mentioned above many of the same releases can be found in Australia (REGION 4 / 2 PAL)...

Found the very rare Hapkido here...HKL DVDS EBAY

[TheFlyingPanda]

By-tha-way, thanks wuxiaFan for the info, I just shopped at "chaos.com" and got myself a copy of HKL's Fearless Hyena! This is one of many HKL releases I never got around to buying unfortunately. Still missing Shaolin Wooden Men and Dragon Fist amongst others.

[dionbrother]

The JoySales' classics don't really look that great, but they are consistent, 16X9 and they don't screw with the sound effects. Despite the sometimes worn condition of the prints, I've enjoyed the JS rereleases I've bought.

The Celestial catalogue has impressed me the most, because in every case I'd only scene the SB movies in butchered, cropped form. Enough to overlook enhanced sound, alternate Taiwanese and Singapore cuts, and missing footage.

[Killer Meteor]

Bad remixes, cropping, distoration and standards conversions hamper many "remasters" for me, so kudos to Media Blaster's DVD of 7 Grandmasters, the many Media Blasters Shaws, HKL's Encounters Of The Spooky Kind, and the German DVD company MIG's release of Angela Mao's The Tournament.

[The Dragon]

WB's Enter The Dragon DVD remaster was not bad. The re-edit, re-score, lack of good commentary (How do you have Michael Allin there and not speak honestly of his conflicts with Bruce?!) and John Little's dubbing brought it down a few pegs.

... Oh yeah, and the Blu-Ray terribly begs an HD-audio format!!!

[kungfusamurai]

WildSide Project in France has done a great job, too bad they're region 2 and no english subs.

Even though Bach Films have strangely dark transfers, maybe they're shooting with a camera at a projected image on a screen, they're at least getting out some really rare Korean kung fu flicks. Since they're french, they only have french audio, but their transfers are all 2.35:1 which is nice. They get big points for digging up some rares (at least rare in widescreen).

KFS

[Space]

Does anyone have the Joy Sales releases of Magnificent Butcher, Knockabout, Spooky Encounters and Prodigal Son?

If so, how are they?

[Killer Meteor]

Does anyone have the Joy Sales releases of Magnificent Butcher, Knockabout, Spooky Encounters and Prodigal Son?

If so, how are they?

Prodigal Son is remixed only, I don't know about the others.

The best DVD of Prodigal Son is the German one. It uses the excellent Fortune Star master, and has original Cantonese and English audio tracks (in good original mono) with first rate subtitles.

[chen lung]

Think 'Magnificent Butcher' is a downmix. Whilst it has better image quality, HKL wins in other areas.

HKL's 'Knockabout' (despite a bit of pinking) is probably the best option at the moment.

Can't really comment about 'Spooky Encounters'.

As for 'The Prodigal Son', the German DVD has the best presentation, whilst HKL has the best extras.

[fiol]

Does anyone have the Joy Sales releases of Magnificent Butcher, Knockabout, Spooky Encounters and Prodigal Son?

If so, how are they?

i've

Encounter Of The Spooky Kind

Magnificent Butcher

Knockabout

which were included in the boxset dedicated to him

i ve to admit that i didnt even check em since i ve the HKL releases (for the first 2) and the FOX R1 rls for the other one

[Space]

Cool, thanks guys. I have the Fox R1's of all those discs since they are easier to find and was considering getting the Sammo Hung box set from Joy Sales but maybe not...

[Jesse Smooth]

Any upgrade over anything George Tan has EVER released is impressive in my book.

[Monk Sante]

The German prints rule!

[John]

Something I've learnt over the last decade or so is that there are no sacred cows in the home video world. Every company puts out something dubious at least once in a while; HKL is hardly an exception. Their releases of Police Story and its sequel, Magnificent Butcher, and Iron-Fisted Monk are examples of poor attempts at restoration, particularly with respect to aspect ratios. Even some of their better-rounded releases like The Killer come with some pretty liberal cropping when compared to their German incarnations. Titles like Ninja in the Dragon's Den on the other hand, are simply the best available versions available to consumers, so they aren't without some claim to success.

[Fang Shih-yu]

Tokyo Shock's BD of Heroes Two is the best representation of this Chang Cheh classic, hands down; only the TS DVD comes close to it!

Will all classic "old school" martial arts (or wuxia) classics ever make the jump to BD? There are plenty of contenders for going this route, that's for sure!

In particular, that the "cream of the crop" of Sammo Hung's movies haven't even been considered for the undertaking yet (apparently) is a cryin' shame!

[chen lung]

Their releases of Police Story

Despite New Line Cinema probably looking better than any of them (via their LD) and the ratio/image information issue with HKL, I think the latter is the best looking on DVD.

Titles like Ninja in the Dragon's Den on the other hand, are simply the best available versions available to consumers, so they aren't without some claim to success.

Subs are a bit dodgy and there's suspect remixing, but other than that:wink:.

Tokyo Shock's BD of Heroes Two is the best representation of this Chang Cheh classic, hands down; only the TS DVD comes close to it!

Or the Siren DVD if you don't want frame/shot-cuts or a poor reproduction of the credit sequence:tongue:.

[Sheng]

The German prints rule!

Oh yeah?

Wonder what makes you come up with gross generalisations like that? I'd say the German KF / Wuxia releases (or "Eastern" as they prefer to call 'em) are pretty much a hit or miss affair - and that's me trying to sound as unbiased and diplomatic as possible !

Ever heard about a Company called "Splendid" and their long list of indescribably rotten avoid-at-all-costs releases?

To pick out another Company, let's have a look at the wretched quality of some of the MIB Shaw's. Gotta cope with shit transfers - FIVE DEADLY VENOMS ("Die Unbesiegbaren Fünf") is a case in point - , the kind of transfers that IVL got blasted for in the early days. Or unbearably out-of-sync subs on a number of titles like, for instance, HUMAN LANTERNS or MAGIC BLADE. Add to this the notorious German dubbing that seems to be fabricated in a studio that would otherwise specialize in dubbing porn... (But OK, we can all avoid that by switching to the original audio and staring at the IVL subs that they re-used, can we?)

Granted, only some, not all of the MIB titles were seriously fucked and I hasten to add that I have half a dozen of their Shaws in my own collection that I would deem to be superior to ANY other issue on the market.

Let me dwell a lil' longer on the subject of subtitles that most Companies carelessly stick underneath their "Eastern" releases. Subtitles that seem to be translated, oftentimes terribly, from English subs whenever these are available. Maybe the following is quite an illuminating example: The other day I watched the picture- & presentation-wise pretty decent Koch Media release of 18 BRONZEMEN and noticed that the subs used in the long version of the film were seemingly copied from the horrendous ones made in HK by someone who obviously didn't master more than the barest rudiments of the English language. Now, we're all used to Chinglish subbing on this board, I suppose. But why a Company in Germany that clearly DOES shell out a bit for package and presentation can't even render broken English into half-way comprehensible, grammatically correct German is simply beyond me. But it is as typical as turning over dubbing jobs to a bunch of lobotomized twaddlers and it does shed some light on the amount of respect allotted to the genre in general.

Oh, and at this juncture a remark about the absolutely revolting practice of MIB and pretty much ALL German "Eastern" merchants of inventing the most bewildering and inane titles for the films they license is also due. (A habit compared to which even the Weinstein's re-titling sins appear rather tame!)

Some examples?

CLANS OF INTRIGUE : "Die Brüderschaft der gelben Höllenhunde" ("The brotherhood of the yellow hellhounds").

THE HEROIC ONES : "Die Söhne des gelben Drachen" ("The sons of the yellow dragon")

WEB OF DEATH : "Das Todesnetz der gelben Spinne" ("The deadly web of the yellow spider")

Notice that "yellow" (as in skin colour) is a term cropping up conspicously often in German "Eastern" titles ! Definitely helps to shed some light on the mind-frames of the inventors of such idiocy...

MAGIC BLADE : "Der Todesschlag der Stahlfighter" ("The deathblow of the steel-fighters")

THE BOXER FROM SHANTUNG : "Der Pirat von Shantung" ("The pirate from Shantung").

CRAZY COUPLE : "Schlitzohr & Schlitzauge" ("Chiseler and slit-eye")

I could easily fill a few more pages with this kind of drivel but enough for now...

To balance things out and to end this treatise on a more positive note... Yes, a good number of the efforts of Eyecatcher / New, at least the ones they issued from 2006, are to be applauded and I certainly feel sad that they threw in the towel. (Reason enough to snap up their better releases before they dry up and fetch outlandish, HKL-style collector's prices.)

Unfortunately the companies new in this game like Megamax Films seem to be less concerned about dishing up original audio tracks (only their admittably beautiful print of BUDDAH ASSASSINATOR had one; wish the recent OF COOKS AND KUNG FU offered that option too...)

And I shouldn't forget to cheer Retrofilm for Wang Yu's DESPERATE CHASE and THE MAN FROM HONGKONG (unbelievably translated verbatim as "Der Mann von Hongkong" !!!) and WGF for their King Hu collection (even though I personally slightly prefer the French Film Sans Frontiers issues of TOUCH OF ZEN and RAINING IN THE MOUNTAIN).

To sum it all up, I live here, I can see what is presented in this niche segment of the market (and how it is all presented!) and I truly wish we'd have someone that treats Fu cinema with the kind of care and R.E.S.P.E.C.T. that, say, Tokyo Shock / Media Blasters show (or am I forced to say showed...?) for this idiom. But that'll be daydreaming on my part.

[Monk Sante]

Just my opinion. I personally have been happy with wide-screen releases out of Germany regarding independent Kung Fu films.

[John]

Oh, and at this juncture a remark about the absolutely revolting practice of MIB and pretty much ALL German "Eastern" merchants of inventing the most bewildering and inane titles for the films they license is also due. (A habit compared to which even the Weinstein's re-titling sins appear rather tame!)

I believe the weird titles are a holdover from the films' original release in W. Germany, as many are listed as such on IMDB. I suppose there might be a schlocky appeal of retarded 70s-era titling schemes and old school dubbing; isn't the nostalgia essentially why these have any market at all in Germany anyway? German reviewers do seem to be pretty bummed when there's a new dub. It's also worth pointing out that some of the MIB shaws were good enough to include the original titles near the spine for clarity. I wish Weinstein would at least do that much...Kill Zone is such a #@$% stupid name.

[Sheng]

Kill Zone is such a #@$% stupid name.

I ain't hatin' on the Weinsteins so the naff title didn't stop me from buying the BD.

Anyway, you hit it right on the head when you talk about the "schlocky appeal of retarded 70s-era titling schemes". Could not phrase it any better.

BUT please note that outside of the nostalgic circles you pointed at, there is a lot of gripe and outright contempt for German dubbing. And there has been as long as I care to remember. Not just for today's porn dubs but also, maybe to a lesser extent, for the quaint, albeit qualitatively "better" dubbing of yesteryear. At least the latter, the original

"Kinoton" (i.e. cinema dub) is good for some guffaws of laughter when you wanna get piss-drunk with your bloods...

[spannick]

Sheng, you got some German Titles wrong.

MAGIC BLADE is DER TODESCHLAG DER STAHLFINGER, not "STAHLFIGHTER"

HEROIC ONES is DIE 13 SÖHNE DES GELBEN DRACHEN (you missed the Number)

you should also have mentioned the even more insane Title for CRAZY COUPLE for its first run called DER DAMPFHAMMER VON SEND-LING - but anyone outside of Bavaria and a few insiders would even understand the joke in the title.

and the reason why Megamax has no Original Audio with Subs is because sales are lousy enough without having to pay for that, too. they went out of business after very bad sales for now.

what's the point of that text rampage anyway? you can't change a thing about it and no fan of classic German Dubs will ever want to see the same Movie in Mandarin with Bullshit Subtitles; no matter how you look at it. I personally know only one out of a dozen who would prefer that.

the word respect, which means so much to you, does not mean a thing when the companies lose a lot of money when they try to be respectful. all you got left is - do it all yourself. (like i and others do, because we're fed up with incompetence and idiocy all around us)